Replace BOTH Houston and Ford?

[CranjisMcbasketball 781]

26 minutes ago, Balto said:

1. Fournette is extremely limited in the passing game

Meh...If played all games he was on pace BOTH his rookie year and last year of being in the top 10 in rec as a RB.

 

2. His value is so low at this point the jags would probably send the player and picks for nothing just to get him off their books. Giving up anything of value for an expensive average rb is idiocy.

I agree 100% with everything you said but the expensive part!  He is dirt cheap on that rookie contract for the next few years.  

Looked up his contract. 2019 3 million and 2020 4 million. That’s not insanely high but i consider his value in the negatives so its relative.

compared to a rookie making 500k I consider that a massive overpay.

the interesting thing is apparently his suspension voided his guaranteed money, so i look for the jags to release him anyways so he could be signed for any value.

if i had to sign a rb off the jags roster i would go for tj yeldon anyways who is for sure a free agent.

[Balto 723]

4 minutes ago, CranjisMcbasketball said:

Looked up his contract. 2019 3 million and 2020 4 million. That’s not insanely high but i consider his value in the negatives so its relative.

compared to a rookie making 500k I consider that a massive overpay.

the interesting thing is apparently his suspension voided his guaranteed money, so i look for the jags to release him anyways so he could be signed for any value.

if i had to sign a rb off the jags roster i would go for tj yeldon anyways who is for sure a free agent.

You could be 100% correct BUT for the exact reason you don't want him is why I think his value is super low and still has a very high ceiling....Plus like you said his guaranteed is gone now so why not give up a little to trade for a guy with his low risk high reward? 

[Mloe68 1,521]

8 minutes ago, CranjisMcbasketball said:

Looked up his contract. 2019 3 million and 2020 4 million. That’s not insanely high but i consider his value in the negatives so its relative.

compared to a rookie making 500k I consider that a massive overpay.

the interesting thing is apparently his suspension voided his guaranteed money, so i look for the jags to release him anyways so he could be signed for any value.

if i had to sign a rb off the jags roster i would go for tj yeldon anyways who is for sure a free agent.

It’s interesting you bring Yeldon up because they’ve won more games and been a better offense with him than Fournette.  But I heard a few insiders say they were told by opponents that when Fournette played the play calling became extremely predictable. 

So this tells me that perhaps a better offensive coach like Reid could better tap into his vast potential. Or counter point that he’s limited in what he can do.  They were so inept on offense in Jax, it seems the first option might be most likely.  

[FANATIC 852]

9 hours ago, soonerborn77 said:

I don't think we need Fournette, we can grab any RB in the 3rd or later and plug him into our offense.  If we trade Houston, we can get a better player or at least some picks out of it. 

I agree with Cali Chief...RB are a dime a dozen.....see CJ Anderson.

[Palangi 788]

I wish we could have seen more of darrel Williams last year.  But in sure the coaches have a good idea of what he is. 

[Fmbl2187 2,279]

On 2/14/2019 at 7:03 PM, Balto said:

Houston:  $15.5M cap saved cut or traded

Ford:  estimates of $16.325M for franchise tag

total savings:  $31.825M saved

 

Now take that $31M and sign two of the DE’s in FA below..

 

1). DeMarcus Lawrence

2). Jadeveon Clowney

3). Trey Flowers

4). Frank Clark

5). Ezekiel Ansah

6). Brandon Graham

 

Could go after Lawrence and then grab Graham.  Both should be cheaper overall than Houston/Ford.

 

Or do you keep one of our guys and go after Graham?

or do we go with other guys on the team, grab graham and also a safety like Collins?

No way we get rid of both Ford and Houston.  Only one will go.  Of course, I have been shocked before, but I don't think for a minute that would happen.  Defense is the focus this year.  You don't get rid of both and start a project.  K-Pass is a gigantic question mark, possible a true bust.  I wouldn't be shocked if they let him go, unless Spags sees somthing that Sutton didn't.

[DieHard 2,061]

Houston can play several positions well. I would hold him for sure. Strong side backer and D end both fit well with him IMO. Ford is a one trick pony. Doubt we hold onto him even on the tag. Maybe tag one year but that is too much IMO.

[jetlord 10,210]

4 hours ago, Fmbl2187 said:

No way we get rid of both Ford and Houston.  Only one will go.  Of course, I have been shocked before, but I don't think for a minute that would happen.  Defense is the focus this year.  You don't get rid of both and start a project.  K-Pass is a gigantic question mark, possible a true bust.  I wouldn't be shocked if they let him go, unless Spags sees somthing that Sutton didn't.

Maybe Kpass just needs coaching and a slot that fits his talents.  At least that's my hope.  Otherwise, it's time to cut bait. 

[sith13 1,746]

1 hour ago, jetlord said:

Maybe Kpass just needs coaching and a slot that fits his talents.  At least that's my hope.  Otherwise, it's time to cut bait. 

Already seen as a better fit at 4-3 DE due to his size so he might get a full year at the position as well as situational DT at times. However unless there's early production he might be out of town sooner.

[Fmbl2187 2,279]

The new reality is completely different from what we have calculated while speculating in the forum during the off-season.  The new reality is that we are going to have to spend a holy fortune for the next decade and a half keeping Mahomes. With cap limitations, that means the front office is going to have a ton of very young fast, cheap players on their first or second contracts, especially on defense. We are going to have to change our calculus. Players we love are going to be traded or released or allowed to go in FA. Instead we will need great position coaches who can get young guys up to speed quickly and the best scouts possible for the drafts.  Each year we will have to pick up one great FA who is is starting to decline and hope to get a good year out of him.

This new reality will sink in when everyone starts screaming about why we let this or that favorite player go. It wouldn't surprise me to see anyone go anymore.

 

 

 

 

[sith13 1,746]

3 minutes ago, Fmbl2187 said:

The new reality is completely different from what we have calculated while speculating in the forum during the off-season.  The new reality is that we are going to have to spend a holy fortune for the next decade and a half keeping Mahomes. With cap limitations, that means the front office is going to have a ton of very young fast, cheap players on their first or second contracts, especially on defense. We are going to have to change our calculus. Players we love are going to be traded or released or allowed to go in FA. Instead we will need great position coaches who can get young guys up to speed quickly and the best scouts possible for the drafts.  Each year we will have to pick up one great FA who is is starting to decline and hope to get a good year out of him.

This new reality will sink in when everyone starts screaming about why we let this or that favorite player go. It wouldn't surprise me to see anyone go anymore.

 

 

 

 

That's basically the norm, if you cannot spend a lot of money on different players then the way to go is spending that money on coaches. I'm still hoping for Mahomes to go with a Brady-like approach to his contract but even in that case we'll need some afterthoughts to perform on defense to be successful.

[Fmbl2187 2,279]

1 hour ago, jetlord said:

Maybe Kpass just needs coaching and a slot that fits his talents.  At least that's my hope.  Otherwise, it's time to cut bait. 

Yep. Personally, I think he is gone. Chiefs like versatility, not guys who suck at everything except one narrow thing that fits their talent. Too many injuries to afford that. If they keep him, it would be for STs and low pay.

[kkuenn 3,613]

I would hope he does a Brady contract but Brady has Gisele who had made a ton of money too, so Brady could afford to make less.

[FANATIC 852]

2 hours ago, kkuenn said:

I would hope he does a Brady contract but Brady has Gisele who had made a ton of money too, so Brady could afford to make less.

So you arte saying a guys that makes millions have an affordability issue? Must have lots of credit card debt? I always laugh when rich guys say " got to feed my family". 

[kkuenn 3,613]

57 minutes ago, FANATIC said:

So you arte saying a guys that makes millions have an affordability issue? Must have lots of credit card debt? I always laugh when rich guys say " got to feed my family". 

Nope but to think a guy us going to give up millions in his first big contract is far reaching.  Brady did so after a few signings and had his sponsor deals, rings and then being married to someone who made so much too. The only thing I can think of is his dad made so much money he saw what was actually is needed and will be a team first type guy in contract signing but he still will get paid a lot.

 

As this link will show you, he was up there in his extensions in his first part of his career and at the time for pay as a QB. It is easy to just take 14 million per year now with him winding down and already making so much money plus the fact your wife is worth 360 million dollars. 

 

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.thestreet.com/amp/lifestyle/sports/tom-brady-net-worth-14595966

[jetlord 10,210]

21 hours ago, Fmbl2187 said:

Yep. Personally, I think he is gone. Chiefs like versatility, not guys who suck at everything except one narrow thing that fits their talent. Too many injuries to afford that. If they keep him, it would be for STs and low pay.

My reasoning is, based on nothing more than hope, that KPass could fit in to a 4-3 DE if he has the proper coaching and consistent reps.  He, along with Jones, Nnadi, and Speaks could make a good front for years since they are all young.  Not saying that will happen, but it would be cap friendly, at least until Jones gets paid.  I would love to be the proverbial fly on the wall while Spags reviews film and plans for next season.

[Palangi 788]

23 hours ago, jetlord said:

Maybe Kpass just needs coaching and a slot that fits his talents.  At least that's my hope.  Otherwise, it's time to cut bait. 

I think we will see real development with his hand in the dirt full time

[jetlord 10,210]

Just now, Palangi said:

I think we will see real development with his hand in the dirt full time

Let's hope a different DC and position coach will click with him.  He supposedly has the tools and just needs to learn the techniques.  

[Palangi 788]

2 hours ago, jetlord said:

Let's hope a different DC and position coach will click with him.  He supposedly has the tools and just needs to learn the techniques.  

And not worry about going into coverage

[Lamardirts 2,121]

39 minutes ago, Palangi said:

And not worry about doing into coverage

This and our potent offense should make life easier and better for the guys up front.   I look for a huge year from Ford and Jones in this new D and I wouldn't be surprised to see Speaks and Kpass step up their game as well.

I'm hoping this new scheme will allow younger players to step in and help earlier on as that is going to be the MO moving forward with our team.   

[Iluvhouse24 1,808]

On 2/17/2019 at 7:30 PM, DieHard said:

Houston can play several positions well. I would hold him for sure. Strong side backer and D end both fit well with him IMO. Ford is a one trick pony. Doubt we hold onto him even on the tag. Maybe tag one year but that is too much IMO.

As with most of your posts, I would pretty much expect the opposite. Theres no way Houston is playing a true SAM in a 4-3. And he is the older declining player who allows us to free up a ton of cap room.

Ford on the other hand is in his prime, and hungry. I dont think theres any way in hell a new DC comes in and looks at last years game tape and says " meh...we can do without #55. Guys that lead the league in QB pressures are easy to find."

Heres what Veach said about Ford last week...

“When we drafted Dee a few years ago, all those things we envisioned for him, he showed that he was that player,” Veach said. “We are running a different scheme now, and Steve (Spagnuolo)—he actually started the process on Monday to go through the roster and look at these guys. Not knowing where they were drafted or how much money they’re making, just gives you a pure feel on strengths, weaknesses and how we can get better and then we’ll throw our dialogue in there with the other information in regard to what we can do to get creative in regard to structuring this thing from a cap standpoint. Obviously, Dee’s a player that had done so much for us, in particular, last year, that we’re excited about bringing him back.”

[sith13 1,746]

I also think that Houston would be a much better fit at DE than Ford. Can set the edge against the run and the one area he has declined in 2018 (coverage) is no longer necessary. Still a beast in pass rush. However he's too expensive to keep for another year so unless there's an extension or a team friendly restructure I doubt he stays in town. We'll likely have to pay both Jones and Hill this year so there's the economics of the whole thing involved. 

I wouldn't take Veach's comments about Ford at face value, he might simply be trying to increase his market for a trade or may be he's genuine but it would probably still be a prove-it year. I doubt he's considering an extension for Ford at this point. 

[oldtimer 8,694]

16 minutes ago, Iluvhouse24 said:

As with most of your posts, I would pretty much expect the opposite. Theres no way Houston is playing a true SAM in a 4-3. And he is the older declining player who allows us to free up a ton of cap room.

Ford on the other hand is in his prime, and hungry. I dont think theres any way in hell a new DC comes in and looks at last years game tape and says " meh...we can do without #55. Guys that lead the league in QB pressures are easy to find."

Heres what Veach said about Ford last week...

“When we drafted Dee a few years ago, all those things we envisioned for him, he showed that he was that player,” Veach said. “We are running a different scheme now, and Steve (Spagnuolo)—he actually started the process on Monday to go through the roster and look at these guys. Not knowing where they were drafted or how much money they’re making, just gives you a pure feel on strengths, weaknesses and how we can get better and then we’ll throw our dialogue in there with the other information in regard to what we can do to get creative in regard to structuring this thing from a cap standpoint. Obviously, Dee’s a player that had done so much for us, in particular, last year, that we’re excited about bringing him back.”

 

 thats laughable.

[DieHard 2,061]

Houston is stronger at DE than Ford and has better run stuffing and coverage skills at the Sam. I would put him at DE.

[Spfdchiefsfan 621]

We need Houston AND Berry to restructure.  Berry should because he can not get on the field!  Houston so we can afford to fix the defense.  Houston has never struck me as a ME first kind of guy, I hope he will be willing to help.  Berry, IS the epidemy(sp?) of a me first guy when it comes to playing(IMO), and no way he restructures.  He's getting paid to do absolutely NOTHING!