PAChiefsFan79 136 Posted March 14, 2019 Share Posted March 14, 2019 7 hours ago, Docbarnabee said: Bet you he gets surgery now. There have been multiple sources that have reported "surgery isn't necessary, Berry can play with this issue, and it's pain management issue" It's been said by doctors during the season and doctors in the off-season. Would you have surgery when every doctor is telling you it is not necessary? Or would you just keep going to doctors until one finally agrees with what the "medically challenged" keep repeating? Not trying to sound like a dick, but I can't blame Berry in the slightest if multiple doctors are feeding him the same information. We listen to doctors because they are supposed to be the experts in their fields. We are also free to get multiple opinions, as we have the right to advocate for our own health. And Berry has done so. Seems like Berry is listening to his doctors. If he has the surgery now (March of 2019) he might not even be ready to play for a new team until the season starts, which complicates issues further when trying to learn a new system and develop chemistry with new teammates. Anytime you are shaving away bone there will be issues with flexion from that bone and it can take months to get flexibility back without pain. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biggjliv4 1,292 Posted March 14, 2019 Share Posted March 14, 2019 Extremely valid point. The tough part is this is where they were at all last year. You can't pay a guy that much money in the hopes he will be able to manage the pain this season. May be better or may flare right back up with real contact. To me, KC has gone above and beyond for Berry. I think he should have offered to restructure as he's been highest paid safety and missed over 3 years of play now. . He's a great person and role model, but that's not valid enough reason to make 17m a year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
liquidfriend 1,151 Posted March 14, 2019 Share Posted March 14, 2019 The problem with the theory is doctors told him he could play and just needs to manage everything last year, and he could barely play at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dhitter 1,426 Posted March 14, 2019 Share Posted March 14, 2019 Physical part aside...Berry himself in an interview this past season said he could have probably played the previous week but just didn't feel it in his spirit. Or something along those lines. When a player gets to the point that he doesn't play because he just "isn't feeling it"?...that is a major red flag. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SarcasticOne 24 Posted March 15, 2019 Share Posted March 15, 2019 10 hours ago, Biggjliv4 said: Extremely valid point. The tough part is this is where they were at all last year. You can't pay a guy that much money in the hopes he will be able to manage the pain this season. May be better or may flare right back up with real contact. To me, KC has gone above and beyond for Berry. I think he should have offered to restructure as he's been highest paid safety and missed over 3 years of play now. . He's a great person and role model, but that's not valid enough reason to make 17m a year. I agree 100%. In fact, I wonder why people aren't talking about Houston leaving instead of Berry. Houston played for the Chiefs, the past two years, including last year when Berry was roaming the sidelines, too hurt to play but not too hurt to collect his check. When Berry got cancer, the Chiefs didn't cut him. They paid his salary the entire time he was gone (if I'm wrong, someone correct me) and gave him emotional support. When Berry came back, instead of thankful, he took a hard line on his negotiations and demanded to get "paid" and get "respect" and got respected to the tune of becoming the highest paid Safety in football. He has played, what, one full game and three partial games since? I can understand not playing in 2017 as he couldn't walk. But he sure could walk in 2018 and did walk, up and down the sidelines. Like you wrote, "KC has gone above and beyond for Berry." I've lost my respect for him. And, yes, I'm sure it probably keeps him up nights worry about it...not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troyofoc 361 Posted March 15, 2019 Share Posted March 15, 2019 Agree I'm going to miss Houston more than the other 2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fmbl2187 2,279 Posted March 15, 2019 Share Posted March 15, 2019 11 minutes ago, Troyofoc said: Agree I'm going to miss Houston more than the other 2. Me too. He knows his shit and is still aggressive and a sure tackler. Probably has a few more good years left in him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Calichief 3,024 Posted March 15, 2019 Share Posted March 15, 2019 Houston is my favorite chief of the last decade. And Brandon Flowers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
liquidfriend 1,151 Posted March 15, 2019 Share Posted March 15, 2019 It was long time for Justin Houston to head on out. He had some nice moments last season, but he also had some large stretches where it was pretty clear he wasn't the same player anymore. When I saw him get completely driven away from the ball on a clear block by Gronk in the last game, I was ready to turn the page. He's running mostly on fumes at this point. I think the other teams have also noticed, which is why he's still sitting out there without any visits scheduled as of yet. If he was as big of a deal as this board has made him out to be, I can't help but think he would of been picked up within 24 hours. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fmbl2187 2,279 Posted March 15, 2019 Share Posted March 15, 2019 14 hours ago, PAChiefsFan79 said: There have been multiple sources that have reported "surgery isn't necessary, Berry can play with this issue, and it's pain management issue" It's been said by doctors during the season and doctors in the off-season. Would you have surgery when every doctor is telling you it is not necessary? Or would you just keep going to doctors until one finally agrees with what the "medically challenged" keep repeating? Not trying to sound like a dick, but I can't blame Berry in the slightest if multiple doctors are feeding him the same information. We listen to doctors because they are supposed to be the experts in their fields. We are also free to get multiple opinions, as we have the right to advocate for our own health. And Berry has done so. Seems like Berry is listening to his doctors. If he has the surgery now (March of 2019) he might not even be ready to play for a new team until the season starts, which complicates issues further when trying to learn a new system and develop chemistry with new teammates. Anytime you are shaving away bone there will be issues with flexion from that bone and it can take months to get flexibility back without pain. I don't believe that Berry suddenly started hating the Chiefs and wanted to play somewhere else for selfish reasons when they finally have a QB who can take the team to the promised land. There is no logic in assuming he was faking sick to get off the team. He is, and was never, that kind of person or player. The only explanation is that it kept hurting, and he could feel that it was degrading what he could do . We saw the degradation when he finally got on the field. Its just one of those things. The docs are being conservative in their recommendations, but they aren't the ones feeling the discomfort out there on the field. Berry was likely conflicted between wanting to play, hurting too much to play, not wanting to be blamed for not playing while being paid a fortune, trying to be loyal to the team that stood by him, and sought out opinions that would spare him from the procedures that he had more than enough of, between his achilles, his chemotherapy for Hodgkin's, etc. He is probably humiliated by all of it. I don't blame him and just feel sorry for him. The hatred that keeps brewing louder and louder around here ignores that and tries to shift blame onto Berry for the situation. I don't think he deserves that. But I do think he will realize his playing days are over soon enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biggjliv4 1,292 Posted March 15, 2019 Share Posted March 15, 2019 I don't think there's hatred for Berry, I think it's just disappointment. Had he offered to renegotiate his deal I think people would have had his back, but he didn't. Team has been behind him through thick and thin and paid him a ton of money every time. At some point he should have reciprocated. Sure it's not his fault for his health issues, but he could of done a solid to the team and the fan base by releaving some of the financial strain. Works both ways, even with great human beings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SarcasticOne 24 Posted March 15, 2019 Share Posted March 15, 2019 47 minutes ago, Biggjliv4 said: I don't think there's hatred for Berry, I think it's just disappointment. Had he offered to renegotiate his deal I think people would have had his back, but he didn't. Team has been behind him through thick and thin and paid him a ton of money every time. At some point he should have reciprocated. Sure it's not his fault for his health issues, but he could of done a solid to the team and the fan base by releaving some of the financial strain. Works both ways, even with great human beings. What he said! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fmbl2187 2,279 Posted March 15, 2019 Share Posted March 15, 2019 I understand the disappointment and share it. But this guy is a human being in a state of obvious confusion and uncertainty right now with everything coming at him. 1) Does he try to continue his career, and what does he do if he doesn't continue it? 2) Should he have surgery or not and try to re-start his career when healed if he does? 3) Agents giving him one set of options and recommendations. 4) Teams contacting him 5) Family and friends giving him other advice 6) How does he thank the Chiefs appropriately? 7) Where is he moving, and how does that all happen and get arranged? That is a lot for anyone, not just a 30 year old (A kid, in my perspective). It's overwhelming. Give him a break. That's really my only point. I wish him the best. I am glad he is not going to be a cripple or have a damaged brain from CTE or financial uncertainty or struggle the rest of his life. He has plenty of blessings to count. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan4pres 125 Posted March 15, 2019 Share Posted March 15, 2019 I wonder if Houston would consider re-signing with KC if the market doesn't come around to the numbers he is looking for. Of the three, I would think that Houston has the game that could play in any formation. His only real weakness is lack of coverage skills. Too bad he lost that first step that he had when he entered the league. He was every bit the player that Mack is now. Damn Zambo injured him with friendly fire. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VIChiefsFan 262 Posted March 15, 2019 Share Posted March 15, 2019 21 minutes ago, Dan4pres said: I wonder if Houston would consider re-signing with KC if the market doesn't come around to the numbers he is looking for. Of the three, I would think that Houston has the game that could play in any formation. His only real weakness is lack of coverage skills. Too bad he lost that first step that he had when he entered the league. He was every bit the player that Mack is now. Damn Zambo injured him with friendly fire. I highly doubt it, has that ever happened? I would love him back but I would think pride would keep him away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
liquidfriend 1,151 Posted March 15, 2019 Share Posted March 15, 2019 1 hour ago, Dan4pres said: I wonder if Houston would consider re-signing with KC if the market doesn't come around to the numbers he is looking for. Of the three, I would think that Houston has the game that could play in any formation. His only real weakness is lack of coverage skills. Too bad he lost that first step that he had when he entered the league. He was every bit the player that Mack is now. Damn Zambo injured him with friendly fire. I don't think KC is interested in bringing him back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Holmes4six! 974 Posted March 15, 2019 Share Posted March 15, 2019 with berry and houston both guys that i know of didn’t want to renegotiate. on top of that there salaries. the one thing that is not being mentioned that veach tried to do last year was change the mindset of the defense. this did not happen maybe due to these veterans. bring in HB and removing these vets allows the mindset change to happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sith13 1,746 Posted March 17, 2019 Share Posted March 17, 2019 On 3/15/2019 at 9:33 PM, Dan4pres said: I wonder if Houston would consider re-signing with KC if the market doesn't come around to the numbers he is looking for. Of the three, I would think that Houston has the game that could play in any formation. His only real weakness is lack of coverage skills. Too bad he lost that first step that he had when he entered the league. He was every bit the player that Mack is now. Damn Zambo injured him with friendly fire. It's highly unlikely but probable. It was mostly a financial decision and if they are considering him back in the mix I would imagine they offered him an extension during that restructure. That being said the market may not be what he's expecting but coming back to the Chiefs on a reduced deal wouldn't be as attractive as a similar deal with the Pats or something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the Warparty 69 Posted March 17, 2019 Share Posted March 17, 2019 On 3/14/2019 at 10:35 PM, Troyofoc said: Agree I'm going to miss Houston more than the other 2. No doubt! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhataLerror 370 Posted March 18, 2019 Share Posted March 18, 2019 Holdouts never did this team any favors. Huge contracts given to Houston and Berry resulted in teams that had no depth at key positions. Now no one gets a ring. The Chiefs were 0-3 in games Berry started last year. I appreciate the fight anyone has with cancer, but "heart of the team" was a stupid justification for a terrible contract that paid a premium for a position that should be complementary. Dwayne Bowe produced more on his extension, and his contract was awful, save for the provision that allowed the Chiefs to cut him with a reduced dead money hit after a suspension for drug abuse. When fans don't support holdouts, the team will perform better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan4pres 125 Posted March 18, 2019 Share Posted March 18, 2019 On 3/17/2019 at 2:07 AM, sith13 said: It's highly unlikely but probable. It was mostly a financial decision and if they are considering him back in the mix I would imagine they offered him an extension during that restructure. That being said the market may not be what he's expecting but coming back to the Chiefs on a reduced deal wouldn't be as attractive as a similar deal with the Pats or something. I don't know if both Houston and Berry had blinders on but if they were in fact offered restructured deals and refused them, then they are not the teammates you want anyway. Both had to know we were up against the salary cap (mostly due to their own existing contracts) and the Chiefs needed some relief in order to bring the FA's that were needed to help their side of the ball. There is no way in hell that Berry or Houston will get paid the amounts they would have gotten from the Chiefs without restructuring. They also know this team is on the cusp of a SB. If they truly were about winning they would have restructured. They both already got paid more than they will ever need in two lifetimes. I am just so disappointed in both of them. At least Ford stated he wanted to stay with the Chiefs, was willing to take the Franchise tag without holding out and may have even been willing to take a smaller salary for a multi-year deal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhataLerror 370 Posted March 18, 2019 Share Posted March 18, 2019 5 minutes ago, Dan4pres said: I don't know if both Houston and Berry had blinders on but if they were in fact offered restructured deals and refused them, then they are not the teammates you want anyway. Please tell me why anyone didn't recognize that they weren't team players when they held out? So many people here told me how wrong I was, and how you have to pay players like them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sith13 1,746 Posted March 18, 2019 Share Posted March 18, 2019 12 minutes ago, Dan4pres said: I don't know if both Houston and Berry had blinders on but if they were in fact offered restructured deals and refused them, then they are not the teammates you want anyway. Both had to know we were up against the salary cap (mostly due to their own existing contracts) and the Chiefs needed some relief in order to bring the FA's that were needed to help their side of the ball. There is no way in hell that Berry or Houston will get paid the amounts they would have gotten from the Chiefs without restructuring. They also know this team is on the cusp of a SB. If they truly were about winning they would have restructured. They both already got paid more than they will ever need in two lifetimes. I am just so disappointed in both of them. At least Ford stated he wanted to stay with the Chiefs, was willing to take the Franchise tag without holding out and may have even been willing to take a smaller salary for a multi-year deal. I think it would depend on the manner of a restructure. I doubt Houston would reject a 4-year deal giving him something less than market value but I can understand him rejecting a 2-year deal as being a free agent at 32 isn't that attractive. I'm not sure if they offered anything to Berry though. We are already paying as much as he would make in 2019 in dead money and IMO it's more of an injury thing. Reminds me of the JC or DJ releases. Ford was an exceptional case, an injured guy rejecting 15 million to prove he can stay healthy would just be bad business. He made the statement while Sutton was here but I don't think they ever wanted to keep him after Spags came to town and not sure if he would like to play a year under the tag in a new scheme in which he was dealt a terrible hand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kkuenn 3,613 Posted March 18, 2019 Share Posted March 18, 2019 Ian Rapoport @RapSheet · 14m Source: Former #Chiefs S and new free agent Eric Berry is visiting the #Cowboys on Tuesday. His first visit. They have a need there... Curious to see how much he will get and then how much he actually plays this year when he does sign. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balto 723 Posted March 18, 2019 Share Posted March 18, 2019 7 minutes ago, kkuenn said: Ian Rapoport @RapSheet · 14m Source: Former #Chiefs S and new free agent Eric Berry is visiting the #Cowboys on Tuesday. His first visit. They have a need there... Curious to see how much he will get and then how much he actually plays this year when he does sign. Good for him. I hope he lands "softly" on his feet and finds a new home. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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