Rolling Defense (Week 9 updated)

[Iluvhouse24 1,808]

9 hours ago, Mloe68 said:

I'll add to that. I really like and respect your GM. But the ridiculous contract he gave to said mediocre QB was also a big part in the Ravens decline. Had he traded or moved on from Flacco after he played way over his head in that short run (think Nick Foles), he would have been an absolute genius. But he had to learn the hard way. I credit him from learning from that awful mistake and moving Flacco to Denver where Elway has now assumed the role of bungling GM. But it wasn't hard considering the Ravens werent winning and had 1 playoff trip in 5 or 6 seasons. That's why I credit Brett Veach a ton. His first big move as GM he moves a proven winning QB from a two time division champ and rolls with the 22 year old rookie. Cajones brother! 

Newsome did that contract didnt he? I think DeCosta was still asst GM then.

[liquidfriend 1,151]

Yes and yes.  Getting any sort of compensation out of Flacco and that deal was some Houdini stuff.

[Handswarmer 645]

12 hours ago, liquidfriend said:

It was headed that direction.  I decided to cut the foreplay and get right to the chase.

I like that. Get down to business.

[Handswarmer 645]

14 hours ago, kkuenn said:

Hell you won with Dilfer as a qb....just saying

On a historic defense...

[Handswarmer 645]

12 hours ago, Mloe68 said:

Nothing available? You could have had Andy Dalton in 2011 who’s absolutely in the same league with Flacco and saved 15 million per year. Slam dunk.  It was a horrendous decision by Newsome  and it cost the Ravens the next 6 seasons. 

Revisionist history. Hell, you could have had him too....why didn't the awesome Chiefs front office go get him?

BTW. he sucks. Veritable definition of mediocre.

[Handswarmer 645]

11 hours ago, DieHard said:

You bitches quit pulling each other’s hair. Don’t make me pull this car over!

You know how I roll....

[Handswarmer 645]

17 hours ago, Mloe68 said:

I'll add to that. I really like and respect your GM. But the ridiculous contract he gave to said mediocre QB was also a big part in the Ravens decline. Had he traded or moved on from Flacco after he played way over his head in that short run (think Nick Foles), he would have been an absolute genius. But he had to learn the hard way. I credit him from learning from that awful mistake and moving Flacco to Denver where Elway has now assumed the role of bungling GM. But it wasn't hard considering the Ravens werent winning and had 1 playoff trip in 5 or 6 seasons. That's why I credit Brett Veach a ton. His first big move as GM he moves a proven winning QB from a two time division champ and rolls with the 22 year old rookie. Cajones brother! 

Again, that was market price.

He is 10-5 in the playoffs with a SB MVP.

Ozzie signed him to the contract with the Owners blessing. Eric DeCosta took over this year and moved him.

[Handswarmer 645]

7 hours ago, Iluvhouse24 said:

Newsome did that contract didnt he? I think DeCosta was still asst GM then.

Correct- eric has turned down an offer to be GM from 22 teams. His loyalty is unmatched.

[Mloe68 1,521]

2 hours ago, Handswarmer said:

Again, that was market price.

He is 10-5 in the playoffs with a SB MVP.

Ozzie signed him to the contract with the Owners blessing. Eric DeCosta took over this year and moved him.

It’s like Moneyball. GMs that pay market price for proven QBs who aren’t elite or even close in many cases, have a gross misunderstanding of where wins and Super Bowl contenders come from.

And those contracts condemn the team into mediocrity because they don’t have resources to build a compete team because of his contract. But they continue to be just competitive enough because of stability at QB to never get premium draft picks either.

Caught in the middle is a wasteland that the Ravens endured because of that contract. I was adamant about it the day he signed it that it wouldn’t work. Now retroactively there’s no debating that it didn’t. 

At least they learned something after missing the playoffs 4 out of 5 years. Not many teams in a league full of parity do that.  But some teams and GMs apparently will never learn. I applaud DeCosta then for getting it.  

[Handswarmer 645]

32 minutes ago, Mloe68 said:

It’s like Moneyball. GMs that pay market price for proven QBs who aren’t elite or even close in many cases, have a gross misunderstanding of where wins and Super Bowl contenders come from.

And those contracts condemn the team into mediocrity because they don’t have resources to build a compete team because of his contract. But they continue to be just competitive enough because of stability at QB to never get premium draft picks either.

Caught in the middle is a wasteland that the Ravens endured because of that contract. I was adamant about it the day he signed it that it wouldn’t work. Now retroactively there’s no debating that it didn’t. 

At least they learned something after missing the playoffs 4 out of 5 years. Not many teams in a league full of parity do that.  But some teams and GMs apparently will never learn. I applaud DeCosta then for getting it.  

You act like no one else in the league would make that deal. Bull. Pioli gave up a 2nd rd pick (34th overall so essentially a #1) and then paid him $46 million for 4 years of suckage.

At least with Flacco we went to the playoffs 7 of 11 years, making the AFCCG 3 times and winning a Super Bowl.

The last two season we did not make the playoffs, the season came down to one play each. The Immaculate Extension and 4th&9.

The defense gave up those plays.

You are being dishonest with yourself if you think other GM's would not have resigned their SB winning QB. Look around and see what the others are getting who haven't won anything.

[Mloe68 1,521]

1 hour ago, Handswarmer said:

You act like no one else in the league would make that deal. Bull. Pioli gave up a 2nd rd pick (34th overall so essentially a #1) and then paid him $46 million for 4 years of suckage.

At least with Flacco we went to the playoffs 7 of 11 years, making the AFCCG 3 times and winning a Super Bowl.

The last two season we did not make the playoffs, the season came down to one play each. The Immaculate Extension and 4th&9.

The defense gave up those plays.

You are being dishonest with yourself if you think other GM's would not have resigned their SB winning QB. Look around and see what the others are getting who haven't won anything.

The Ravens went from consistently winning playoff games to consistently missing the playoffs all together after signing that extremely dumb contract. 1+1 = 2.  

A defense incapable of overcoming weaknesses because of CAP issues and of course unable to cover up for its mediocre QB play either. This isn’t hard.

Smart organizations don’t make that deal.  Plain and simple. It was highly debated at the time by a lot of people.  It’s not remotely debatable now. 

[the Warparty 69]

On 9/12/2019 at 10:55 AM, kkuenn said:

Again down 37 to 13 at one point and he threw 142 yards and 2 tds in more or less called garbage time. 

Thx KKiuen, that was going to be my response, but you beat me to it.

[Mloe68 1,521]

6 hours ago, Handswarmer said:

Revisionist history. Hell, you could have had him too....why didn't the awesome Chiefs front office go get him?

BTW. he sucks. Veritable definition of mediocre.

Mismanagement of QB situation was one of the major reasons I wanted Pioli fired. He didn’t want a legit competitive backup to protect his awful trade for Cassel. Passing on Wilson and Kaepernick was absurd with Tyler Palko as the backup.  And Red is every bit as good and certainly much more valuable than Flacco with that contract.  

[Iluvhouse24 1,808]

1 hour ago, Mloe68 said:

Mismanagement of QB situation was one of the major reasons I wanted Pioli fired. He didn’t want a legit competitive backup to protect his awful trade for Cassel. Passing on Wilson and Kaepernick was absurd with Tyler Palko as the backup.  And Red is every bit as good and certainly much more valuable than Flacco with that contract.  

Hiring Crennel as HC, trying to create NE West with coordinators, creating a toxic environment inside the building and creating a disconnect with the fans. And Clark still had the decency to take Pioli with him to the Reid interview. 

But I agree, refusing not to bring in a young QB to groom behind Cassel was the biggest disappointment. 

[Mloe68 1,521]

Just now, Iluvhouse24 said:

Hiring Crennel as HC, trying to create NE West with coordinators, creating a toxic environment inside the building and creating a disconnect with the fans. And Clark still had the decency to take Pioli with him to the Reid interview. 

But I agree, refusing not to bring in a young QB to groom behind Cassel was the biggest disappointment. 

Clark Hunt said ill get you any GM you want. This guys under contract, how bout him?   Andy said. Hell no!

[xen 1,010,220]

8 hours ago, Handswarmer said:

Correct- eric has turned down an offer to be GM from 22 teams. His loyalty is unmatched.

He's turned down all interview offers each offseason for the last 7 years hasn't he?  I think you mean he's turned down that many interviews.  Nobody is offering a job without an interview.

[qnet 1,150]

6 hours ago, Mloe68 said:

Mismanagement of QB situation was one of the major reasons I wanted Pioli fired. He didn’t want a legit competitive backup to protect his awful trade for Cassel. Passing on Wilson and Kaepernick was absurd with Tyler Palko as the backup.  And Red is every bit as good and certainly much more valuable than Flacco with that contract.  

 

4 hours ago, Iluvhouse24 said:

Hiring Crennel as HC, trying to create NE West with coordinators, creating a toxic environment inside the building and creating a disconnect with the fans. And Clark still had the decency to take Pioli with him to the Reid interview. 

But I agree, refusing not to bring in a young QB to groom behind Cassel was the biggest disappointment. 

I started not watching games and losing track of what the Chiefs were doing back then. I would come to this board (the prior version of it) to just check what was going on, and it was all downhill and negative. 

[Handswarmer 645]

On 9/14/2019 at 4:43 PM, xen said:

He's turned down all interview offers each offseason for the last 7 years hasn't he?  I think you mean he's turned down that many interviews.  Nobody is offering a job without an interview.

Yes that is what I meant. Bisciotti got chastised by Goodell at a league metting 4 years ago for announcing to everyone to "Leave my Assistant GM alone- he is staying in Baltimore"

[Handswarmer 645]

On 9/14/2019 at 2:29 PM, Mloe68 said:

Mismanagement of QB situation was one of the major reasons I wanted Pioli fired. He didn’t want a legit competitive backup to protect his awful trade for Cassel. Passing on Wilson and Kaepernick was absurd with Tyler Palko as the backup.  And Red is every bit as good and certainly much more valuable than Flacco with that contract.  

comical.

[Mloe68 1,521]

24 minutes ago, Handswarmer said:

comical.

I disgress. Dalton isn't as good as Flacco, but at the time he would have been a much better option at 1/10th the price. Thats the point. Either way you are getting some version of solid/mediocre. Nowhere near elite. And if that's the case. The much cheaper contract is CLEARLY the way to go. 

[Handswarmer 645]

5 minutes ago, Mloe68 said:

I disgress. Dalton isn't as good as Flacco, but at the time he would have been a much better option at 1/10th the price. Thats the point. Either way you are getting some version of solid/mediocre. Nowhere near elite. And if that's the case. The much cheaper contract is CLEARLY the way to go. 

Flacco brought the Broncos back to win the game and the refs screwed Denver.

[Mloe68 1,521]

On 9/13/2019 at 11:55 PM, liquidfriend said:

Yes and yes.  Getting any sort of compensation out of Flacco and that deal was some Houdini stuff.

Agree.  I’ll bet Denver benches him for Lock at some point. Just a horrendous decision by Elway to give up a pick for that clown. 

[Handswarmer 645]

7 minutes ago, Handswarmer said:

Flacco brought the Broncos back to win the game and the refs screwed Denver.

 

3 minutes ago, Mloe68 said:

Agree.  I’ll bet Denver benches him for Lock at some point. Just a horrendous decision by Elway to give up a pick for that clown. 

See above.

[Mloe68 1,521]

15 minutes ago, Handswarmer said:

Flacco brought the Broncos back to win the game and the refs screwed Denver.

Flacco flashed the type of hodge podge play of good passes and crucial errors that you’d expect from a mediocre QB.  And when the Broncos release him after the season they will have to burn 13.5 million in Dead Cap to do it.  A guy the Ravens were laughably paying 24 million per season.  

[FANATIC 852]

Just now, Mloe68 said:

Flacco flashed the type of hodge podge play of good passes and crucial errors that you’d expect from a mediocre QB.  And when the Broncos release him after the season they will have to burn 13.5 million in Dead Cap to do it.  

I am thrilled Joe Fucco is a Bronco   😂