Why has Veach and Andy ignored the Oline in the draft?

[Calichief 3,016]

14 hours ago, WichitaZRide said:

The Chiefs allowed 106 QB hits(9th) and 26 sacks(28th) last season.   League average was 90, so he basically took one more hit per game than average.  Additionally, when you ratio the number of QB hits vs attempts, it drops the oline rank to 11.  While it could certainly be improved on, it wasn't as bad as your statement.  The Chiefs expected a healthy LDT(who had allowed next to no Sacks/Pressures/Hits up to the point of his injury last year) to improve that in 2019.  Combined with an up and coming Reiter I can see why they weren't as worried as the rest of us.

Additionally, the Chiefs are at 57 QB hits(25th) and 20 sacks(28th) in 2019 so far.  That scales out to 76 QB hits and 27 sacks through 16 games.  While I think the original intent of this post was more about the run game than pass protection, that feels like a HUGE improvement since your concern is Mahomes getting hurt.

I think fans in general magnify the number of hits their QB takes because the position is so important to them...

Good post.

The more I rewatch games over the last couple years, it’s appearance mahomes is really helping to mask the ineptitude of the interior oline.

watch last weeks game again. 

 

the second the call is snapped he’s running backwards. 
 

the interior oline is really bad.

[Iluvhouse24 1,808]

1 hour ago, Calichief said:

Good post.

The more I rewatch games over the last couple years, it’s appearance mahomes is really helping to mask the ineptitude of the interior oline.

watch last weeks game again. 

 

the second the call is snapped he’s running backwards. 
 

the interior oline is really bad.

Check out @ChiefinCarolina on Twitter. He posted some really nice breakdowns of our problems in protection on Sunday. Our guards were just abused.

[Lamardirts 2,114]

I agree than Rankins showed some ability.  I think its pretty clear that Reiter is the worse Olineman.  Just last game on 4th and 1 he got blown back 1v1 2 yards into the back field and it happens consistently.   I wouldn't even mind drafting the top rated C in the first.   That would go a long way to solidifying the Oline then cut LDT and find a solid vet to play RG.   

[sith13 1,746]

Rankin and Wiz would definitely be an instant upgrade on the line but I don't know why we take so long to make the switch. In fact we rarely move away from the preset depth chart during the season at OL. 

[DieHard 2,061]

2 hours ago, sith13 said:

Rankin and Wiz would definitely be an instant upgrade on the line but I don't know why we take so long to make the switch. In fact we rarely move away from the preset depth chart during the season at OL. 

That’s true. They usually stick with it. 

[xen 1,010,220]

15 hours ago, sith13 said:

Rankin and Wiz would definitely be an instant upgrade on the line but I don't know why we take so long to make the switch. In fact we rarely move away from the preset depth chart during the season at OL. 

Because continuity on the oline is one of the most important things for a position group that has to act in concert to be effective.

It's not that hard to figure out.

That said put me in the 'our interior oline kinda sucks' camp.  

[reesebobby 5,663]

2 hours ago, xen said:

Because continuity on the oline is one of the most important things for a position group that has to act in concert to be effective.

It's not that hard to figure out.

That said put me in the 'our interior oline kinda sucks' camp.  

Also, Fisher extended in 2016, they signed Schwartz long term in 2016 and extended LDT long term in February 2017.  All of these were pretty significant contracts, 3 of our top 6 in terms of our 2019 cap.  These all happened before Veach was GM and kind of handcuffs him a little on how many resources to use on the OLine.  Especially with the state of the defense going into these drafts.

[sith13 1,746]

2 hours ago, xen said:

Because continuity on the oline is one of the most important things for a position group that has to act in concert to be effective.

It's not that hard to figure out.

That said put me in the 'our interior oline kinda sucks' camp.  

I agree with the continuity. Playing together sure helps a group get better but looking how some individuals did well and elevated the line makes me want to see them in there more. The performances could be Reiter in 2018 type of "good in small samples" thing but I sure wouldn't mind a few names tried there.

[sith13 1,746]

4 minutes ago, reesebobby said:

Also, Fisher extended in 2016, they signed Schwartz long term in 2016 and extended LDT long term in February 2017.  All of these were pretty significant contracts, 3 of our top 6 in terms of our 2019 cap.  These all happened before Veach was GM and kind of handcuffs him a little on how many resources to use on the OLine. 

On paper we have quite a bit of investment at the line, 3 big contracts and 2 guys hoping to get better. I'm pretty sure Veach loves the Schwartz signing but not sure if he likes what else Dorsey left him.

[reesebobby 5,663]

1 minute ago, sith13 said:

On paper we have quite a bit of investment at the line, 3 big contracts and 2 guys hoping to get better. I'm pretty sure Veach loves the Schwartz signing but not sure if he likes what else Dorsey left him.

Yeah.  It's not 100 percent an excuse for not doing better, but I don't think you can really fault him for not getting a bunch of Oline in the draft per the thread title.  I'm pretty sure everyone here knew they needed to focus on the defense. 

[sith13 1,746]

4 minutes ago, reesebobby said:

Yeah.  It's not 100 percent an excuse for not doing better, but I don't think you can really fault him for not getting a bunch of Oline in the draft per the thread title.  I'm pretty sure everyone here knew they needed to focus on the defense. 

I don't think he was expecting such a bad performance from the line. However we should be adding valuable pieces one by one every year.

I think the primary reason for anxiety is seeing Luck retire after so much beating and having Mahomes go through just as brutal punishment due to the line. 

[reesebobby 5,663]

38 minutes ago, sith13 said:

I don't think he was expecting such a bad performance from the line. However we should be adding valuable pieces one by one every year.

I think the primary reason for anxiety is seeing Luck retire after so much beating and having Mahomes go through just as brutal punishment due to the line. 

It's a legitimate concern and one I expect he has more freedom to address in the 2020 draft.  And more urgency.  But I think everyone here would have shit little green apples if he had taken an offensive lineman in the first 4 rounds of this draft. 

[dksww 484]

2 minutes ago, reesebobby said:

It's a legitimate concern and one I expect he has more freedom to address in the 2020 draft.  And more urgency.  But I think everyone here would have shit little green apples if he had taken an offensive lineman in the first 4 rounds of this draft. 

exactly.  Also, due to injuries, the Chiefs have had to shuffle their OL lineup all season and just as we got Rankin up to speed, he got hurt and is out for the season.

 

[reesebobby 5,663]

After this next draft, we can all have 2020 hindsight.  HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA Get it?  2020 hindsight?  That's the year.  Get it?  HAHAHAHAHAHA.  I crack myself up.  Man oh man. 

[FANATIC 852]

Read Full Article Click Link.

https://www.arrowheadpride.com/2019/12/5/20996220/chiefs-pass-protection-issues-start-but-dont-end-on-the-offensive-line

Lately, it appears Andy Reid has taken it upon himself to make it easier on the offensive line by calling moving pockets, sprint-out plays and even bootlegs from play-action. Those — and Mahomes’ mobility — help mask some of the poor pass protection snaps. But when these things start becoming part of the problem, then what?

It’s really been a combination of everything.

Some poor offensive line play — especially on the inside — has not only blown up some plays but is also effecting Reid and Mahomes’ confidence in the unit. There isn’t always a clean pocket to navigate — but when there is, Mahomes vacates it too often because his own internal clock is based on previous failures. And Reid is likely trying to get Mahomes on the move earlier by design.

But just like teams have figured out how to run stunt after stunt to the man-protection side of the offensive line, they are also figuring out how to pressure Mahomes’ early pocket escapes and Reid’s called rollouts.

There is no easy (or instant) fix. But the Chiefs would be wise to bring back some of the quick passing to the short and intermediate parts of the field. Let Mahomes build his confidence back up — and avoid forcing the offensive line to block for so many deep passes until they can once again get on the same page.

[Mloe68 1,521]

1 hour ago, FANATIC said:

 

There is no easy (or instant) fix. But the Chiefs would be wise to bring back some of the quick passing to the short and intermediate parts of the field. Let Mahomes build his confidence back up — and avoid forcing the offensive line to block for so many deep passes until they can once again get on the same page.

That's pretty much all the Chiefs have been doing the last two weeks. And fans blast Andy for play calling. Reality is we don't need a 2003 offensive line with this QB. We just need a solid group. And its just not that in any way so far this year. Hopefully Fish is working his way back to near 100 percent by the playoffs and it could help. As will this group actually playing a few games together again. But for the most part I think only a talent infusion will net the results we really need. In the meantime Andy's gotta adjust the play calling accordingly. 

[sith13 1,746]

15 hours ago, reesebobby said:

It's a legitimate concern and one I expect he has more freedom to address in the 2020 draft.  And more urgency.  But I think everyone here would have shit little green apples if he had taken an offensive lineman in the first 4 rounds of this draft. 

We have been through way too much cr@p at LG over the years to simply complain about some draft capital spent there and I doubt anyone would complain about Mahomes' protection which is the best offensive investment for us right now. 

Back then the concern was CB as we had nobody there but looks like we were bitching about the wrong position. If Moore didn't come up solid with Mahomes out we would be talking about how some rookie QB would have been awesome. 

[Arrowhead78 36]

On 12/3/2019 at 10:41 AM, WichitaZRide said:

Lots of reasons:

• One of the best offenses in the history of football in 2018
• One of the highest rated offensive lines in 2018
• One of the worse defenses in the league in 2018
• 3 of the six highest paid players on the team(in terms of cap space this year) are currently on the Online
• Those same three players are all under contract through at least 2022
• LDT wasn't expected to play as poorly as he has
• The O-line takes up more cap than any other position group on the team already
• If the chiefs would have spent money on Oline over defense the fan base would have put their heads on stakes
• When drafting Rankin in the 3rd rd last year, you expected to see solid play year 2 and for him NOT to end up on IR
• The FA market for online this offseason was either WAY too expensive or not really upgrades over what we currently had
• MOST o-lineman drafted need 2-3 seasons to reach potential.  Chiefs don't have that kind of time or money when in a superbowl window for drafted players

REALLY long story short, the chiefs didn't think they had as big of a problem as everyone else did with their o-line.  They saw 3 very solid spots on the o-line with another elevating from their 2018 3rd round pick and felt that the strength of the rest could make up for one below average spot.  Don't forget that Fisher and Schwartz were both on the injury list all week, meaning they aren't 100% either.

Who was the third round pick in 2018?

[Arrowhead78 36]

On 12/3/2019 at 10:41 AM, WichitaZRide said:

Lots of reasons:

• One of the best offenses in the history of football in 2018
• One of the highest rated offensive lines in 2018
• One of the worse defenses in the league in 2018
• 3 of the six highest paid players on the team(in terms of cap space this year) are currently on the Online
• Those same three players are all under contract through at least 2022
• LDT wasn't expected to play as poorly as he has
• The O-line takes up more cap than any other position group on the team already
• If the chiefs would have spent money on Oline over defense the fan base would have put their heads on stakes
• When drafting Rankin in the 3rd rd last year, you expected to see solid play year 2 and for him NOT to end up on IR
• The FA market for online this offseason was either WAY too expensive or not really upgrades over what we currently had
• MOST o-lineman drafted need 2-3 seasons to reach potential.  Chiefs don't have that kind of time or money when in a superbowl window for drafted players

REALLY long story short, the chiefs didn't think they had as big of a problem as everyone else did with their o-line.  They saw 3 very solid spots on the o-line with another elevating from their 2018 3rd round pick and felt that the strength of the rest could make up for one below average spot.  Don't forget that Fisher and Schwartz were both on the injury list all week, meaning they aren't 100% either.

 

[kkuenn 3,597]

14 minutes ago, Arrowhead78 said:

Who was the third round pick in 2018?

DOD was our pick. Rankin was picked in the 3rd by Cleveland 

[Arrowhead78 36]

3 minutes ago, kkuenn said:

DOD was our pick. Rankin was picked in the 3rd by Cleveland 

I thought Houston picked him and we got him in the Hyde trade?

[kkuenn 3,597]

4 minutes ago, Arrowhead78 said:

I thought Houston picked him and we got him in the Hyde trade?

Yeah that was it. Could not remember if it was Cleveland or Houston trade we got him in.

[Arrowhead78 36]

21 minutes ago, kkuenn said:

Yeah that was it. Could not remember if it was Cleveland or Houston trade we got him in.

Ok cool. I wasn't quite for sure either.