Damien Williams

[Adamixoye 604]

44 minutes ago, Chiefsfan1963 said:

Who votes on the SB MVP, a couple of announcers? 

It's more than a couple and they're not all announcers.  But that doesn't matter.  Players vote using completely different criteria.  You can see this in NBA All-Star voting where guys vote for friends or past their prime stars.  It's not a good reflection of who is objectively the best.  I think we all know Honey Badger was the emotional leader of the defense and one of the emotional leaders of the team.  In that sense he's a perfectly worthy team MVP for the year.  But he's obviously not the best player or the main on-the-field reason that we won.  That was Patrick Lavon Mahomes II and it's not close.

[Okiechief1 425]

1 hour ago, Chiefsfan1963 said:

Who votes on the SB MVP, a couple of announcers? 

A panel of 16 writers and announcers comprise 80 pct of it.   Fans can vote beginning in the 4th quarter and that’s the other 20 pct.   

[Handswarmer 645]

On 2/10/2020 at 3:51 PM, Chiefsfan1963 said:

SB MVP, much like the Heisman are pretty much QB awards. That is unless a player single handedly wins the game for their team. Since Mahomes led the 4th quarter come from behind victory, Williams was going to have to have a SB record game. Had they won and Mahomes played like he did in the other 3 quarters Williams probably would have won.

The NFL tends to push the league in the direction they want. Mahomes being the perceived face of the league, left him as the only choice for SB MVP.

I would have been ok either way, hell I would have been ok will Sammy winning it as well.

2 things- not that I totally disagree with everything you wrote but:

1- Williams ran for 107 yds - 69 of those were AFTER contact. That's amazing and laying the wood.

2- In the last 10 years, no QB MVP threw more than 1 INT.

So, I am not hating on Mahomes, I think he is a great QB, I just think the voters fell in love with the comeback more than what Williams did. Sure. its easier to loook back now, but IMO the facts remain that he should have been the MVP.

And when asked about being the face of the league Mahomes said " There's several guys that can be the face of the NFL," Mahomes replied. "With the NFL and how good the play is, the quarterback play, guys can come out there year in and year out and play great football. Lamar was the unanimous MVP last night and he just had one of the best seasons of all time at quarterback."

So appreciate the humility; Lamar if asked would point to Brady as the GOAT, Brees too, and Mahomes as Super Bwl champ.

[soonerborn77 276]

1 hour ago, Handswarmer said:

2 things- not that I totally disagree with everything you wrote but:

1- Williams ran for 107 yds - 69 of those were AFTER contact. That's amazing and laying the wood.

2- In the last 10 years, no QB MVP threw more than 1 INT.

So, I am not hating on Mahomes, I think he is a great QB, I just think the voters fell in love with the comeback more than what Williams did. Sure. its easier to loook back now, but IMO the facts remain that he should have been the MVP.

And when asked about being the face of the league Mahomes said " There's several guys that can be the face of the NFL," Mahomes replied. "With the NFL and how good the play is, the quarterback play, guys can come out there year in and year out and play great football. Lamar was the unanimous MVP last night and he just had one of the best seasons of all time at quarterback."

So appreciate the humility; Lamar if asked would point to Brady as the GOAT, Brees too, and Mahomes as Super Bwl champ.

It was correct to have been Mahomes.  When we were down 20-10 in the 4th, he went 10-12 for 120 something (can't remember the exact number) and 2 TD's to put us up 24-20.  In that same span, Williams only had 2 touches (granted one was a TD) and I believe if I read this correctly Mahomes in the go ahead drive was responsible for every yard.  Remember, Williams got 38 of his yards to seal the game, but wasn't the reason why we came back to take the lead.  If there was someone else who should have gotten it over Mahomes, I could argue Chris Jones.

[soonerborn77 276]

Down 20-10

First Drive to cut it to 20-17

Williams - 2 rushes for 5 yards

Mahomes - 9 yards rushing, 54 yards passing and 1 TD

Go ahead drive

Williams - no rushes, 5 yard TD catch

Mahomes - 6 yards rushing, 60 yards passing and 1 TD

[azchief21 5,278]

Without Mahomes we wouldn't have won. They don't give the MVP to a player on the losing team so Chiefs fans and Damian Williams know Mahomes is the true MVP. Williams had a helluva game for sure.

[Handswarmer 645]

52 minutes ago, soonerborn77 said:

It was correct to have been Mahomes.  When we were down 20-10 in the 4th, he went 10-12 for 120 something (can't remember the exact number) and 2 TD's to put us up 24-20.  In that same span, Williams only had 2 touches (granted one was a TD) and I believe if I read this correctly Mahomes in the go ahead drive was responsible for every yard.  Remember, Williams got 38 of his yards to seal the game, but wasn't the reason why we came back to take the lead.  If there was someone else who should have gotten it over Mahomes, I could argue Chris Jones.

Why were you down 20-10? Because at 13-10, Mahomes threw an INT. 6 plays later its 20-10

Next possession, Mahomes throws another pick. 49ers can't capitalize, punt it back. Thats the defense

Mahomes wouldn't have had to 'comeback' if he didn't 'set them back' with the back to back INT's

As Peyton Manning once said "Comeback? If I had done my job right, we wouldn't have had to comeback"

JMO

[xen 1,010,220]

4 minutes ago, Handswarmer said:

Why were you down 20-10? Because at 13-10, Mahomes threw an INT. 6 plays later its 20-10

Next possession, Mahomes throws another pick. 49ers can't capitalize, punt it back. Thats the defense

Mahomes wouldn't have had to 'comeback' if he didn't 'set them back' with the back to back INT's

As Peyton Manning once said "Comeback? If I had done my job right, we wouldn't have had to comeback"

JMO

lol the 9ers changed their strategy after that first long pass in the 4th.  

I can assure you it wasn't because they were afraid of Damien Williams.

 

[Handswarmer 645]

27 minutes ago, xen said:

lol the 9ers changed their strategy after that first long pass in the 4th.  

I can assure you it wasn't because they were afraid of Damien Williams.

 

Yes, necessitated by the Back to Back INT's earlier.

[Fmbl2187 2,279]

 

On 2/4/2020 at 12:47 AM, sith13 said:

I'm fine with Williams at RB with Thompson providing the depth. We have major needs elsewhere and looks like Williams has some promise. Besides a couple solid interior linemen will help our run game much better than a RB who's not Henry. 

I like him a lot. He has all around skills as others mentioned, but the combination of them is what puts him on a high level and why Reid is so fond of him.  But another reason I like him, and probably Reid, is because he really doesn't fumble.  He has sure hands and strong arms and can barrel around in a scrum without losing the football.  I hate fumbles, and I have grown used to not worrying about him.  Keep him as #1. I'm certain that being #1 RB on a world championship NFL team brings him a lot of pride, and it should. Since he can run or receive passes, he can play three downs and not clue any opposing defense into guessing what a play will be.

[artsy 1,137]

2 minutes ago, Fmbl2187 said:

 

I like him a lot. He has all around skills as others mentioned, but the combination of them is what puts him on a high level and why Reid is so fond of him.  But another reason I like him, and probably Reid, is because he really doesn't fumble.  He has sure hands and strong arms and can barrel around in a scrum without losing the football.  I hate fumbles, and I have grown used to not worrying about him.  Keep him as #1. I'm certain that being #1 RB on a world championship NFL team brings him a lot of pride, and it should.

Agree. One thing about Damien, is that he does all of the little things. The little things that really help the offense move. I was on the "hater" train for him early in the year, but I started watching him closer and saw that he was an important cog in the wheel. I couldn't figure out what Reid saw in him, but I soon realized it was the little things.

Excellent and willing blocker, good hands, go route runner, never fumbles and plays hard.

The little things.

[azchief21 5,278]

In summary, Chiefs are Super Bowl Champs. 31 other teams are, as Ace Ventura would say,  Laaa oozers.

[xen 1,010,220]

1 hour ago, Handswarmer said:

Yes, necessitated by the Back to Back INT's earlier.

Sure.  No doubt.  Doesn't make it any less true.

[DieHard 2,061]

If we won, it was going to be Pat. He is the face of the NFL. We would not have even been there without him. The same can’t be said of Williams. He had a great game though. No disrespect.

[xen 1,010,220]

https://www.arrowheadpride.com/2020/2/12/21131691/film-review-offensive-takeaways-from-super-bowl-liv

[azchief21 5,278]

Who gives AF if Pat threw two INTS? I wouldn't give a rip if he threw 4. We won. He is a Super Bowl Champion MVP. When I reflect back on the Super Bowl I don't even think of the INTs. 

[Mloe68 1,521]

20 minutes ago, xen said:

https://www.arrowheadpride.com/2020/2/12/21131691/film-review-offensive-takeaways-from-super-bowl-liv

Mahomes just exists almost on a different plane than anyone else in how he impacts the game in so many ways. Mentally he’s just ahead of everyone else and physically he’s simply more gifted. There was no other choice than for him to be MVP and I’d bet our entire locker room would agree. 

[Chiefmanzada 466]

MAHOMES 

5/5, 60 yards, 1 TD 

on drive to put Chiefs up 24-20 

Clutch 💪 MVP baby 

[Adamixoye 604]

5 hours ago, Handswarmer said:

Yes, necessitated by the Back to Back INT's earlier.

We all acknowledge Mahomes wasn't having a great first 3.5 quarters by his standards.  But how poorly he was playing has been overstated.  By a lot.

First, SF deserves some credit.  The narrative going into the game was that they were a top-rated defense, and recent history suggests that top defenses beat top offenses in the Super Bowl.  Everyone said they might be the team who could slow down Mahomes and they did for a while.  Mahomes overcame it in the end and instead of giving him credit people are essentially complaining about style points.

As that link above pointed out, Pat made a lot of good plays through the first few quarters.  He was good on the early TD drive.  He was good on the FG drive.  He put together another good drive before the 2nd INT.  And he was doing it all under a fair bit of pressure.

Mahomes INTs also did not put us in the hole directly.  The interception to Warner was literally one of the worst throws of Mahomes' season, if not the worst it's bottom five or so.  And the 49ers did score a TD on the ensuing drive, but they had to go 55 yards.  It wasn't like it was a pick six or the INT put them in great field position.  It was basically a short punt and the defense didn't hold.  The interception to Moore definitely cost us points but it was more unlucky than a bad throw.  It was behind Tyreek but as I've watched the replays it seems like if Pat had led Tyreek he would have gotten blasted.  So I'm betting Pat was going for the back shoulder, it was maybe a little more behind him than he was intending but Tyreek had his hands on it and then it was a bad deflection.

Jones and Williams, the other two suggestions for MVP that I've heard, didn't really make plays until the end of the game either.  All of Jones' plays that I can remember were in the 4th quarter.  Williams was 16 for 66 on the ground before the long game-sealing run.  The idea that either one was carrying the team while Mahomes was struggling is just untrue.  The whole team was struggling (relatively speaking), then came alive.

You know who made a huge missed play that's getting overlooked?  The subject of this thread, Damien Williams.  He beat his man on the wheel route on the FG drive and Pat made the throw.  Damien gave up / got lost / I don't even know.  That cost us 4 points there.  He had a few nice plays sprinkled throughout the game, but he didn't make any great plays until the very end, when Pat was making them as well.  And Pat's were more important.

TL;DR saying anyone other than Pat was the MVP is just silly contrarian hot takery in search of a ridiculous counternarrative.

[Mloe68 1,521]

18 minutes ago, Adamixoye said:

 

You know who made a huge missed play that's getting overlooked?  The subject of this thread, Damien Williams.  He beat his man on the wheel route on the FG drive and Pat made the throw.  Damien gave up / got lost / I don't even know.  That cost us 4 points there.  He had a few nice plays sprinkled throughout the game, but he didn't make any great plays until the very end, when Pat was making them as well.  And Pat's were more important.

TL;DR saying anyone other than Pat was the MVP is just silly contrarian hot takery in search of a ridiculous counternarrative.

Nice post and I agree with most especially the last part here.  Very important to note our struggles and Pats struggles had a ton to do with everyone on the oline except Schwartz struggling with that dline. Ultimately like he does in most games, Mahomes got the last laugh. I mean the fact WASP was his idea is just the stuff of legend. 
I would add though Williams converted both fourth downs including the now famous shift to Rose Bowl Parade Right direct snap to Damien who got within inches of what would’ve been his third TD.  Also converted a big third down in Chiefs territory on that first TD drive.  Andy put him in a central role in this game from the get go and he responded every big spot we needed. That said it’s inconceivable to me to think Mahomes wasn’t the MVP. He’s the catalyst of everything the 49ers were great at stopping all year especially with a lead. And they simply couldn’t. 

[Adamixoye 604]

4 minutes ago, Mloe68 said:

Nice post and I agree with most especially the last part here.  Very important to note our struggles and Pats struggles had a ton to do with everyone on the oline except Schwartz struggling with that dline. Ultimately like he does in most games, Mahomes got the last laugh. I mean the fact WASP was his idea is just the stuff of legend. 
I would add though Williams converted both fourth downs including the now famous shift to Rose Bowl Parade Right direct snap to Damien who got within inches of what would’ve been his third TD.  Also converted a big third down in Chiefs territory on that first TD drive.  Andy put him in a central role in this game from the get go and he responded every big spot we needed. That said it’s inconceivable to me to think Mahomes wasn’t the MVP. He’s the catalyst of everything the 49ers were great at stopping all year especially with a lead. And they simply couldn’t. 

I agree Williams made a few nice plays earlier in the game, like those 4th downs.  But Pat was making similar plays.  As the link above pointed out, the way Pat played the pitch was critical to Williams being able to make it.  The Rose Bowl play was successful because of good design and good execution, especially by the line.  He played well except for whatever happened on that wheel route.  But he wasn't carrying the team or anything like that.

[Chiefmanzada 466]

Glad Williams and the rest of the Chiefs didn't fumble. Not sure why but fumbles are just kick to the balls. worst than interceptionz. 

[moons314 2,463]

28 minutes ago, Adamixoye said:

We all acknowledge Mahomes wasn't having a great first 3.5 quarters by his standards.  But how poorly he was playing has been overstated.  By a lot.

First, SF deserves some credit.  The narrative going into the game was that they were a top-rated defense, and recent history suggests that top defenses beat top offenses in the Super Bowl.  Everyone said they might be the team who could slow down Mahomes and they did for a while.  Mahomes overcame it in the end and instead of giving him credit people are essentially complaining about style points.

As that link above pointed out, Pat made a lot of good plays through the first few quarters.  He was good on the early TD drive.  He was good on the FG drive.  He put together another good drive before the 2nd INT.  And he was doing it all under a fair bit of pressure.

Mahomes INTs also did not put us in the hole directly.  The interception to Warner was literally one of the worst throws of Mahomes' season, if not the worst it's bottom five or so.  And the 49ers did score a TD on the ensuing drive, but they had to go 55 yards.  It wasn't like it was a pick six or the INT put them in great field position.  It was basically a short punt and the defense didn't hold.  The interception to Moore definitely cost us points but it was more unlucky than a bad throw.  It was behind Tyreek but as I've watched the replays it seems like if Pat had led Tyreek he would have gotten blasted.  So I'm betting Pat was going for the back shoulder, it was maybe a little more behind him than he was intending but Tyreek had his hands on it and then it was a bad deflection.

Jones and Williams, the other two suggestions for MVP that I've heard, didn't really make plays until the end of the game either.  All of Jones' plays that I can remember were in the 4th quarter.  Williams was 16 for 66 on the ground before the long game-sealing run.  The idea that either one was carrying the team while Mahomes was struggling is just untrue.  The whole team was struggling (relatively speaking), then came alive.

You know who made a huge missed play that's getting overlooked?  The subject of this thread, Damien Williams.  He beat his man on the wheel route on the FG drive and Pat made the throw.  Damien gave up / got lost / I don't even know.  That cost us 4 points there.  He had a few nice plays sprinkled throughout the game, but he didn't make any great plays until the very end, when Pat was making them as well.  And Pat's were more important.

TL;DR saying anyone other than Pat was the MVP is just silly contrarian hot takery in search of a ridiculous counternarrative.

Absolutely agree.  And I can't remember where I read it, but Pat did indeed say that on the second pick he intentionally threw it behind Hill because he knew he was going to get blown up by the oncoming defender.  He was trying to protect his receiver, and the pick wasn't even some great defensive play, it was a tip drill that was a 50/50 that the defense caught.  The bottom line is simply that in that situation, the Chiefs still come back with Damien, but don't come back without Pat, and I've been harping on that blown TD that Williams failed at getting his head around, because that wasn't the first time it happened this season. 

[moons314 2,463]

6 minutes ago, Adamixoye said:

I agree Williams made a few nice plays earlier in the game, like those 4th downs.  But Pat was making similar plays.  As the link above pointed out, the way Pat played the pitch was critical to Williams being able to make it.  The Rose Bowl play was successful because of good design and good execution, especially by the line.  He played well except for whatever happened on that wheel route.  But he wasn't carrying the team or anything like that.

Exactly.  He was averaging 4.1 ypc on 16 carries for 66 or something yards I can't remember specifically.  The game sealing run gave him the bulk of his stats.  He had a decent game, but wasn't some unstoppable force that carried the team to victory.  

[Balto 723]

Again......it’s called most valuable player!

How many other QBs in the NFL could of done what Mahomes did in this Super Bowl?  Not many 

How many other RBs in the NFL could of done what Williams did in the Super Bowl?  Exactly

 

MOST VALUABLE PLAYER......NOT......PLAYED BEST GAME