Schwartz Has Surgery

[Holmes4six! 968]

 

I would not at all. People think we need a 2nd WR and possibly doing so in the 1st. A great TE would give us this, plus a blocker too if needed. I would be fine having a great TE to come in, learn and eventually take over for Kelce.

I would love this pick over a WR. 

[Iluvhouse24 1,808]

30 minutes ago, Holmes4six! said:

I would love this pick over a WR. 

Would really be incredible to have 2 TE of that caliber. Add a solid cost effective WR ( ex: Josh Reynolds) then shore up this line and allow CEH to be the weapon he can be...This offense would be ridiculous.

[kkuenn 3,598]

6 minutes ago, Iluvhouse24 said:

Would really be incredible to have 2 TE of that caliber. Add a solid cost effective WR ( ex: Josh Reynolds) then shore up this line and allow CEH to be the weapon he can be...This offense would be ridiculous.

A good lb and de, we would be even better as a whole. We can do it as there are needs but we can fill them. Veach is smart one to do so too. He has shown a knack so far, just hope the O line is addressed before the 4th round or in FA.

[Iluvhouse24 1,808]

15 minutes ago, kkuenn said:

A good lb and de, we would be even better as a whole. We can do it as there are needs but we can fill them. Veach is smart one to do so too. He has shown a knack so far, just hope the O line is addressed before the 4th round or in FA.

Yeah we have plenty of needs. I've just always wondered how ridiculous this offense would be with 2 badass TEs. 

[Holmes4six! 968]

 

Yeah we have plenty of needs. I've just always wondered how ridiculous this offense would be with 2 badass TEs. 

I’ve been saying it for a while now. Another stud TE would be huge. If defenses want to play back we could run out 3-TE sets and force the defense to change. One thing we didn’t do in the Super Bowl. We didn’t force or dictate anything. 
 

[Lamardirts 2,114]

4 hours ago, Iluvhouse24 said:

Veach 2nd round picks: Breeland Speaks, Juan Thornhill, Mecole Hardman, Willie Gay Jr.

Thornhill is the only one worth a 2nd round pick.    Gay is super talented but you can't draft a guy who can barely see the field in his first year when our LB core was so pathetic.   Seriously its not hard to deduce iq and rapid decision making prior to the draft.   If he can't learn the system fast enough he can't be the 2nd round pick there.   And I like the guy and glad we drafted him but 2nd round was steep.    Hardman has been somewhat of a disaster since he got here.  We have to manufacture touches for him and he was a super raw route runner which should have been a huge major flag.   The idea that we had to have a speed guy to make our offense work is a slap in the face of Mahomes.   Speaks was a head scratcher from the get go a tweener with a motor but no real skill and regardless if the team running a 3-4 to draft an undersized DE and overweight and lacking athlete for OLB it just didn't make sense.   Juan was a home run until he got hurt.    1/4 deserved the pick 2/4 have value but more in the 3rd/4th round and 1/4 was a colossal bust.   

I love Gay but I'm not overconfident he is going to be able to play 3 downs next year.    I hope I'm dead wrong but there wasn't much progress this year and anyone that athletic that can't get Ben Niemann off the field is concerning.   

I also don't have any confidence Hardman can do anything other than be a speed gadget player moving forward.   

[Lamardirts 2,114]

2 hours ago, Holmes4six! said:

I’ve been saying it for a while now. Another stud TE would be huge. If defenses want to play back we could run out 3-TE sets and force the defense to change. One thing we didn’t do in the Super Bowl. We didn’t force or dictate anything. 
 

You are right but Oline play had a lot to do with that.   Your D looks amazing when 4 dudes generate 50% pressure.   They were on him so fast even screens wouldn't work.   Mahomes knew it too in the 2nd half....played his heart out but there wasn't any confidence in that oline.    I would like another talented TE so you could run more heavy personal and run some hurry with Andy creating deep routes, then screens, and runs with that personal.  Would be a ton of fun to watch!

[Calichief 3,016]

On 2/24/2021 at 1:20 PM, xen said:

Well if he was trying to get back for the playoffs that may not have been an option.

There was a point where he wasn’t even at the facility I think. It was inevitable imo.

glad he’s coming back 

[SEMO 6,811]

12 hours ago, xen said:

Borderline.  Hed be fine at end of rd 1 somewhere in rd 2.  I think he's gone by the time we pick again in rd 2.  

Disagree.  He's first rd talent.  I would call him a 1-2 guy.  But that’s the talent pool you're going to be looking at at the end of rd 1.

I think he tops out in round 2, depending on how he tests.  I like Freiermuth more for our offense anyway.

[sith13 1,746]

9 hours ago, Lamardirts said:

Thornhill is the only one worth a 2nd round pick.    Gay is super talented but you can't draft a guy who can barely see the field in his first year when our LB core was so pathetic.   Seriously its not hard to deduce iq and rapid decision making prior to the draft.   If he can't learn the system fast enough he can't be the 2nd round pick there.   And I like the guy and glad we drafted him but 2nd round was steep.    Hardman has been somewhat of a disaster since he got here.  We have to manufacture touches for him and he was a super raw route runner which should have been a huge major flag.   The idea that we had to have a speed guy to make our offense work is a slap in the face of Mahomes.   Speaks was a head scratcher from the get go a tweener with a motor but no real skill and regardless if the team running a 3-4 to draft an undersized DE and overweight and lacking athlete for OLB it just didn't make sense.   Juan was a home run until he got hurt.    1/4 deserved the pick 2/4 have value but more in the 3rd/4th round and 1/4 was a colossal bust.   

I love Gay but I'm not overconfident he is going to be able to play 3 downs next year.    I hope I'm dead wrong but there wasn't much progress this year and anyone that athletic that can't get Ben Niemann off the field is concerning.   

I also don't have any confidence Hardman can do anything other than be a speed gadget player moving forward.   

I agree we can't keep drafting for hope in the 2nd round. We have the best QB in the NFL which means anyone drafted in earlier rounds should be a starter until we fix every position. I loved what Gay brought to the team whenever he played and thought he would be a huge upgrade if he started but can't draft a guy in 2nd only to have him sit behind losers that we call LBs. 

[Iluvhouse24 1,808]

10 hours ago, Lamardirts said:

Thornhill is the only one worth a 2nd round pick.    Gay is super talented but you can't draft a guy who can barely see the field in his first year when our LB core was so pathetic.   Seriously its not hard to deduce iq and rapid decision making prior to the draft.   If he can't learn the system fast enough he can't be the 2nd round pick there.   And I like the guy and glad we drafted him but 2nd round was steep.    Hardman has been somewhat of a disaster since he got here.  We have to manufacture touches for him and he was a super raw route runner which should have been a huge major flag.   The idea that we had to have a speed guy to make our offense work is a slap in the face of Mahomes.   Speaks was a head scratcher from the get go a tweener with a motor but no real skill and regardless if the team running a 3-4 to draft an undersized DE and overweight and lacking athlete for OLB it just didn't make sense.   Juan was a home run until he got hurt.    1/4 deserved the pick 2/4 have value but more in the 3rd/4th round and 1/4 was a colossal bust.   

I love Gay but I'm not overconfident he is going to be able to play 3 downs next year.    I hope I'm dead wrong but there wasn't much progress this year and anyone that athletic that can't get Ben Niemann off the field is concerning.   

I also don't have any confidence Hardman can do anything other than be a speed gadget player moving forward.   

I'd agree with you if we had a different HC and staff. But Reid has proven many times over the years his loyalty to coaches and players supercedes his desire to have the best 11 on the field. Even if its subconscious, he's done it his whole career.

His desire to maintain continuity and have veterans than won't make mistakes on the field takes priority over having the most talent or playmaking ability.

We all know damn well we had better options on the offensive line most of the year, and in the SB. But there was no chance Reid was gonna play Durant, Rankin, Kilgore, etc. And it cost us a chance to repeat.

Andrew Wylie had played 1 game at OT since college. And it was the Atlanta game, where he was absolutely abused. Stefan Wisniewski had started 1 game all season. And it was at LG in week 17. Mike Remmers hadn't started a game at LT since 2016. But Reid decided to roll with THIS lineup in the 3rd most important game of his HC career. And gave them no help on over 90% of our passing downs. 

When we all saw the backup line we played week 17 against SD was better than our starters looked all year... beyond a shadow of a doubt.

So this is why I think there's a chance that Gay Jr was more ready than we realize. Ben Niemann is literally not good at anything on a football field. He is one of the least productive LBs I've ever watched play. You don't think there's a chance Gay would have outplayed him? But Reid trusts vets. And he values continuity.

So much so that he has at least 1 less ring because of it.

[Lamardirts 2,114]

31 minutes ago, Iluvhouse24 said:

I'd agree with you if we had a different HC and staff. But Reid has proven many times over the years his loyalty to coaches and players supercedes his desire to have the best 11 on the field. Even if its subconscious, he's done it his whole career.

His desire to maintain continuity and have veterans than won't make mistakes on the field takes priority over having the most talent or playmaking ability.

We all know damn well we had better options on the offensive line most of the year, and in the SB. But there was no chance Reid was gonna play Durant, Rankin, Kilgore, etc. And it cost us a chance to repeat.

Andrew Wylie had played 1 game at OT since college. And it was the Atlanta game, where he was absolutely abused. Stefan Wisniewski had started 1 game all season. And it was at LG in week 17. Mike Remmers hadn't started a game at LT since 2016. But Reid decided to roll with THIS lineup in the 3rd most important game of his HC career. And gave them no help on over 90% of our passing downs. 

When we all saw the backup line we played week 17 against SD was better than our starters looked all year... beyond a shadow of a doubt.

So this is why I think there's a chance that Gay Jr was more ready than we realize. Ben Niemann is literally not good at anything on a football field. He is one of the least productive LBs I've ever watched play. You don't think there's a chance Gay would have outplayed him? But Reid trusts vets. And he values continuity.

So much so that he has at least 1 less ring because of it.

There is definitely truth to what you are saying.   It would have been better to roll  Rankin, Allegretti, Reiter, Wylie, Remmers.   Which will always confuse me.  Continuity only happens when guys play the same position on the oline and learn how to play next to the same dudes.   What we did in the SB was move guys who had gotten comfortable next to other sub par dudes and they made it work to a decent degree of success but moving them all around was a recipe for disaster.   

Regarding Gay.  I think he was definitely an upgrade over Nieman but it was clear he didn't have a clue what was going on and needed those other trash LB's to help get him in position.   I'm holding high hopes this offseason helps because he is a physically gifted player and we need him to play all 3 downs.

[Iluvhouse24 1,808]

26 minutes ago, Lamardirts said:

Regarding Gay.  I think he was definitely an upgrade over Nieman but it was clear he didn't have a clue what was going on and needed those other trash LB's to help get him in position.   I'm holding high hopes this offseason helps because he is a physically gifted player and we need him to play all 3 downs.

That's actually a really good point. How the hell could we expect these linebackers to help him on the field. Its literally taken 3 full years for Hitchens to look like a competent run defender.

Fuck we've been watching him attack the wrong gaps for 2 yrs. And offensive lineman never had to worry about climbing to the second level to seal off the Mike. Hitchens did it for them. "Here let me run myself right out of this fucking play." 

[xen 1,010,220]

11 hours ago, sith13 said:

I agree we can't keep drafting for hope in the 2nd round. We have the best QB in the NFL which means anyone drafted in earlier rounds should be a starter until we fix every position. I loved what Gay brought to the team whenever he played and thought he would be a huge upgrade if he started but can't draft a guy in 2nd only to have him sit behind losers that we call LBs. 

Reaching for need like that is the best way to end up with a shitty team.  

[ChiefThunder 153]

Has it been reported what type of procedure Schwartz had on his back.....fusion, disc replacement, laminectomy?

[xen 1,010,220]

9 hours ago, ChiefThunder said:

Has it been reported what type of procedure Schwartz had on his back.....fusion, disc replacement, laminectomy?

I haven't seen shit.  They just keep saying "back".  Would love to know. 

[Iluvhouse24 1,808]

2 hours ago, xen said:

I haven't seen shit.  They just keep saying "back".  Would love to know. 

 

[sith13 1,746]

16 hours ago, xen said:

Reaching for need like that is the best way to end up with a shitty team.  

With Mahomes in town Chiefs are always contenders, hence in "win-now" mode. Can't really keep drafting for future and most of them don't even pan out.

[xen 1,010,220]

3 hours ago, sith13 said:

With Mahomes in town Chiefs are always contenders, hence in "win-now" mode. Can't really keep drafting for future and most of them don't even pan out.

Yeah most draft picks over time don't pan out for every team.  That should not change your draft strategy.  When you go fishing for need and pass up better players to do so you'll end up with a mediocre team.

[Fmbl2187 2,279]

At a position of great need, we should either go for a one year rental on an experienced guy and draft somebody who needs a year to develop, or simply move up in the draft to grab a four year college started who can plug right in.  I favor the latter, because it is sounding like Schwartz merely has a little protruding disc material in his lumbar spine that is pressing on a sensory nerve.  If that is what it is, then the surgery would be to merely trim that disc material away.  Then  he would be back as good as new.

[jetlord 10,209]

On 2/26/2021 at 8:08 PM, xen said:

Reaching for need like that is the best way to end up with a shitty team.  

When there's a need at nine different positions, they can draft for need without reaching.  OT, OG, OC, WR, TE, Edge, LB, CB, and S.  BPA and need will overlap a lot this year.  

[Lamardirts 2,114]

I love always taking the bpa but there does need to be some balance.   I would prefer we stay active in FA and fill some of our biggest holes which would allow us to go more bpa.   Maybe these TV deals will help us out and get the cap closer to what it was next year.   

[xen 1,010,220]

10 hours ago, jetlord said:

When there's a need at nine different positions, they can draft for need without reaching.  OT, OG, OC, WR, TE, Edge, LB, CB, and S.  BPA and need will overlap a lot this year.  

The answer up high in the draft is always BPA at a position of need but we don't really know yet if all those positions will be needs still on draft day.  Depends on what we do before then obviously.

[jetlord 10,209]

3 hours ago, xen said:

The answer up high in the draft is always BPA at a position of need but we don't really know yet if all those positions will be needs still on draft day.  Depends on what we do before then obviously.

Not worth beating the old BPA vs. need to death, but even after FA there's needs at nearly every position.  If Breeland, Taco, and Watkins resign with the Chiefs,, that changes the landscape slightly but there's still longer term needs at CB, DE, and WR.  No way can the Chiefs completely fix the LT and OC positions through FA even if Schwartz makes it back this fall.  Anyway, the Chiefs don't often go BPA.  CEH wasn't ranked there.  If Zaven Collins is still at the top of the board when the Chiefs pick, they probably won't go that direction.  This is the most interesting draft that I can remember for the Chiefs.  

[Iluvhouse24 1,808]

11 minutes ago, jetlord said:

 Anyway, the Chiefs don't often go BPA.  CEH wasn't ranked there. 

How were you able to get a look at their board?