Trey Smith blood clots

[Fmbl2187 2,279]

This worries me greatly.  A young healthy guy suddenly gets pulmonary emboli?  This makes me think he has a thrombotic disorder.  These are usually inherited. I don't know what the experts found, but he could have one of a hundred different deficiencies, such as Anti-thrombin III deficiency.  If he has it a third time, he is done with football.  The only treatment would be to give him anti-coagulants.  That would put him a huge risk in a game like football.  All the excitement about him should be reserved. I find it a huge risk until proven otherwise.

[Iluvhouse24 1,808]

I'm gonna go ahead and be excited without reservation.

[liquidfriend 1,151]

He played 2 years after it and I am confident the Chiefs medical team will monitor him 100%.

 

Not too worried.

[Fmbl2187 2,279]

I am. I know a few things about it. Enough to worry with reason...for him.

[AFCWEST 1,238]

With Job Security Veach can take some high reward risks. Other GMs not so much.

[KC Warpaint 3,234]

 I am certain that he has received the best information regarding his condition before he ever pursued an NFL Career. More Certain that the Chiefs Medical will have his best interests in mind before he ever steps on the practice field

[reesebobby 5,662]

10 hours ago, Fmbl2187 said:

This worries me greatly.  A young healthy guy suddenly gets pulmonary emboli?  This makes me think he has a thrombotic disorder.  These are usually inherited. I don't know what the experts found, but he could have one of a hundred different deficiencies, such as Anti-thrombin III deficiency.  If he has it a third time, he is done with football.  The only treatment would be to give him anti-coagulants.  That would put him a huge risk in a game like football.  All the excitement about him should be reserved. I find it a huge risk until proven otherwise.

It happened once.  He has played 2 full seasons since.  I don't know a lot about him, but he sounds like a great kid and a tremendous athlete.  A huge huge value pick and I can't see how anyone would not be happy to take a flier on him at 226. 

[AFCWEST 1,238]

2 minutes ago, reesebobby said:

It happened once.  He has played 2 full seasons since.  I don't know a lot about him, but he sounds like a great kid and a tremendous athlete.  A huge huge value pick and I can't see how anyone would not be happy to take a flier on him at 226. 

His interview with Schwartz seems to indicate he has limited # of practices. 

[sith13 1,746]

First of all football or not I hope he keeps healthy, that's the primary concern. Regarding his status as a Chief the staff will probably take a detailed look at him and keep him on a short leash throughout his career, however long it may be. If his health is no concern then it's great value with almost no risk. 

[Fmbl2187 2,279]

28 minutes ago, AFCWEST said:

With Job Security Veach can take some high reward risks. Other GMs not so much.

True.  I am more thinking about risks to Smith though, not to Veach. He is just a kid.  With ATIII deficiencies, the clots start in the teens or 20's and then become more frequent. It can be treated to protect him, but that would make him even more vulnerable to the opposite, bleeding.  Not a good outlook for playing football.  Blood clots in the lungs out of the blue in a 20 year old male are simply not a freak, one-off experience. This kid has an abnormal clotting tendency, whether he has had recurrences or not.  Remember, he had this twice. I just hope he is not being put in jeopardy for dying young.  I love  football, but it ain't everything.

[Fmbl2187 2,279]

36 minutes ago, KC Warpaint said:

 I am certain that he has received the best information regarding his condition before he ever pursued an NFL Career. More Certain that the Chiefs Medical will have his best interests in mind before he ever steps on the practice field

You really think so with money involved?  If so, I have some land in Fiji I'd like to sell you.   Sports physicians don't know shit about coagulation disorders.  It is not in their wheelhouse and not needed in their jobs. This kid has been to two major institutions, but the measurement of 70% reduced levels of things like Anti-thrombin III is extremely difficult and expensive.  And there are many other things besides that particular  blood factor that can do the same thing. Another episode, and he is a "one and done."  Not a good investment, even if he puts in a good year or two. 

[AFCWEST 1,238]

11 minutes ago, Fmbl2187 said:

True.  I am more thinking about risks to Smith though, not to Veach. He is just a kid.  With ATIII deficiencies, the clots start in the teens or 20's and then become more frequent. It can be treated to protect him, but that would make him even more vulnerable to the opposite, bleeding.  Not a good outlook for playing football.  Blood clots in the lungs out of the blue in a 20 year old male are simply not a freak, one-off experience. This kid has an abnormal clotting tendency, whether he has had recurrences or not.  Remember, he had this twice. I just hope he is not being put in jeopardy for dying young.  I love  football, but it ain't everything.

Yes I understood that. 

[Fmbl2187 2,279]

1 minute ago, AFCWEST said:

Yes I understood that. 

I know.

[soonerborn77 276]

Even if he doesn't play a down, I'm assuming there's about a 80% chance a 6th round pick wouldn't be relevant on our roster in a few years anyways....

It's worth the risk at that pick.

[Biggjliv4 1,292]

11 hours ago, Fmbl2187 said:

This worries me greatly.  A young healthy guy suddenly gets pulmonary emboli?  This makes me think he has a thrombotic disorder.  These are usually inherited. I don't know what the experts found, but he could have one of a hundred different deficiencies, such as Anti-thrombin III deficiency.  If he has it a third time, he is done with football.  The only treatment would be to give him anti-coagulants.  That would put him a huge risk in a game like football.  All the excitement about him should be reserved. I find it a huge risk until proven otherwise.

That was the concern, they limited him to 1 or 2 practices a week due to the possibility of internal bleeding from the anticoagulants.  Share your concern, not sure he will ever be a starter and kept to a rotational guy if that.  Who wants to be the team that enables a kid to have an embolism, stroke, or heart attack on the field.  Hope it works out for him because he's a great kid, but there are some things you can't beat, especially in the physical game of football. 

[xen 1,010,220]

For Bil:

The best doctors in town put their heads together. A doctor in Boston, an international expert in clotting disorders and chief of cardiovascular medicine at Harvard, got involved. After that, Smith went to Vanderbilt Medical Center for cardiac evaluation.

After six months of anticoagulants and baby aspirins, there were no signs of blood clots. In July 2018, he was cleared to play.

[Biggjliv4 1,292]

Just now, xen said:

For Bil:

The best doctors in town put their heads together. A doctor in Boston, an international expert in clotting disorders and chief of cardiovascular medicine at Harvard, got involved. After that, Smith went to Vanderbilt Medical Center for cardiac evaluation.

After six months of anticoagulants and baby aspirins, there were no signs of blood clots. In July 2018, he was cleared to play.

Hadn't seen that, thanks for sharing. 

[oldtimer 8,686]

just  an FYI, point being altho it seems like a lot of $$ to many of us its over 4 years and hardly worth risking  your life for..but then again some/many do it for much less

NFL Draft 2020: 6th Round Pick Salary Projections

PICKS	SALARY RANGE
180-190	$662,972-$655,258

[kkuenn 3,597]

1 hour ago, soonerborn77 said:

Even if he doesn't play a down, I'm assuming there's about a 80% chance a 6th round pick wouldn't be relevant on our roster in a few years anyways....

It's worth the risk at that pick.

Lol did you see our sb line last year and where they were picked at in the draft? Many 5th to 6th round or later played a lot. 

[Fmbl2187 2,279]

1 hour ago, xen said:

For Bil:

The best doctors in town put their heads together. A doctor in Boston, an international expert in clotting disorders and chief of cardiovascular medicine at Harvard, got involved. After that, Smith went to Vanderbilt Medical Center for cardiac evaluation.

After six months of anticoagulants and baby aspirins, there were no signs of blood clots. In July 2018, he was cleared to play.

I know.  I read that, also.  There aren't many people who are both "expert in clotting disorders" and also chiefs of cardiovascular medicine.  I have no doubt he is an expert in cardiovascular medicine, but I would hope that Smith also was evaluated by a hematologist and had a large number of tests done quantifying different pro-coagulant factor levels.  That is extremely complex and expensive.  What they did and tested may have been great and very impressive, but who did the interpretation of the tests, and how quantitative were the the tests?  A 70% level of ATIII is abnormal. I also question his credentials as an expert in BOTH cardiology and in clotting disorders.  HIghly unusual.  If I knew his name, i could look those up.  Either way, the dx is clinical.  Fact:  He is a a very young man who spontaneousy got clots in his lungs for no apparent reason. And it happened twice.  He was cleared to play based on his heart being evaluated and normal. Two years without a recurrence means nothing at his age.  These things start slowly and increase with age.  He has a thrombotic disorder until proven otherwise.  There is probably something missing I don't know, because I wasn't there.  But I did specialize in blood and clotting disorders as a clinical pathologist, and taught coagulation disorders for some time.  What we are being told does not sound right and is suspicious, because he and his family want him to play, and a lot of dollars are thrown around in the NFL.  I'll shut up about it now, but I would bet on him not playing.  What I wouldn't bet on is him not dying a premature death from a blood clot as a young adult, even if it is in his thirties or forties unless he takes lifelong anti-coagulant medication. If they did not find WHY he got those clots, then there is a problem.

[xen 1,010,220]

12 minutes ago, Fmbl2187 said:

I know.  I read that, also.  There aren't many people who are both "expert in clotting disorders" and also chiefs of cardiovascular medicine.  I have no doubt he is an expert in cardiovascular medicine, but I would hope that Smith also was evaluated by a hematologist and had a large number of tests done quantifying different pro-coagulant factor levels.  That is extremely complex and expensive.  What they did and tested may have been great and very impressive, but who did the interpretation of the tests, and how quantitative were the the tests?  A 70% level of ATIII is abnormal. I also question his credentials as an expert in BOTH cardiology and in clotting disorders.  HIghly unusual.  If I knew his name, i could look those up.  Either way, the dx is clinical.  Fact:  He is a a very young man who spontaneousy got clots in his lungs for no apparent reason. And it happened twice.  He was cleared to play based on his heart being evaluated and normal. Two years without a recurrence means nothing at his age.  These things start slowly and increase with age.  He has a thrombotic disorder until proven otherwise.  There is probably something missing I don't know, because I wasn't there.  But I did specialize in blood and clotting disorders as a clinical pathologist, and taught coagulation disorders for some time.  What we are being told does not sound right and is suspicious, because he and his family want him to play, and a lot of dollars are thrown around in the NFL.  I'll shut up about it now, but I would bet on him not playing.  What I wouldn't bet on is him not dying a premature death from a blood clot as a young adult, even if it is in his thirties or forties unless he takes lifelong anti-coagulant medication. If they did not find WHY he got those clots, then there is a problem.

I believe I also read that the 2nd issue turned out to be a false alarm.  Just an fyi.

[West 6,713]

Thank Bil,

 

I have to defer to the folks paying the contract for Trey Smith.   Veach walked through the work the team and their paid medical experts went though in evaluating Smith.

Also, there will be medical clauses (standard in NFL Contracts) involved to limit the Chiefs' liability.

Therefore, we share the same worry about Trey Smith choosing to play football.  While you may be right in terms of the personal risks, we really do not have the specific data for Trey.  Therefore, we do not truly know his "level" of risk.

I have to respect his rights to make his own choices about his life.  As we all know, a football player has the "right to choose"

w

[Fmbl2187 2,279]

31 minutes ago, xen said:

I believe I also read that the 2nd issue turned out to be a false alarm.  Just an fyi.

That would be great.

[Fmbl2187 2,279]

24 minutes ago, West said:

Thank Bil,

Therefore, we share the same worry about Trey Smith choosing to play football.  While, you may be right in terms of the personal risks, we really do not have the specific data for Trey.  Therefore, we do not truly know his "level" of risk.

 

w

That's true, and he absolutely has a right to choose for himself, and none of us has the details, which are confidential anyway.   I'm certain he has signed a waiver for liabliity. The team does that for everyone for any kind of risk.. I am just uncertain how much he actually knows in order to make that decision for himself.  Young men are pretty cavalier about risk.  I know I was.  It takes a lot of plain luck to get old.  I just feel like he should take some actual anti-coagulant. But if he does....no football.  Best scenario: he plays, is valuable to the team, and lives a long time.

[West 6,713]

amen.