DK Metcalf

[DieHard 2,061]

2 hours ago, CranjisMcbasketball said:

guys im not saying fisher specifically. my point is more general. To me, Stud WR making 15-20 mil a year plus below average LT making 8 is a better use of cap dollars than decent LT making 15-20 and average WR making 8. thats my only point, you can insert whatever names into those scenerios you want.

likewise on defense i want the D line to be making 50 mil and the secondary 20, rather than D line sucking and paying secodary 50 mil.

interesting to see what the chiefs do and how time proves who was correct. fun off season for sure!

I think biggest problem is that Fish is in his thirties. It still leaves the most important O line position with no long term solution. 

[Thegoatee 1,780]

Why does a DK Metcalf thread turn into a discussion on Eric Fisher and Orlando Brown?

My concern with Metcalf is whether he can be an over the middle guy or is just a bombs away WR. We need a Wes Welker / Julian Edleman kind of guy.

[xen 1,010,220]

5 minutes ago, Thegoatee said:

Why does a DK Metcalf thread turn into a discussion on Eric Fisher and Orlando Brown?

My concern with Metcalf is whether he can be an over the middle guy or is just a bombs away WR. We need a Wes Welker / Julian Edleman kind of guy.

A slow slot receiver?  

I mean, we have lots of slot options and no X receiver, but I guess.

[Iluvhouse24 1,808]

29 minutes ago, xen said:

A slow slot receiver?  

I mean, we have lots of slot options and no X receiver, but I guess.

Check you inbox, floppy tits.

[Balto 723]

1 hour ago, Thegoatee said:

Why does a DK Metcalf thread turn into a discussion on Eric Fisher and Orlando Brown?

My concern with Metcalf is whether he can be an over the middle guy or is just a bombs away WR. We need a Wes Welker / Julian Edleman kind of guy.

Honestly defenses have turned Hill into a over the middle receiver and we need an elite deep threat plus a big body red zone guy….Metcalf gives us both

[CranjisMcbasketball 780]

3 hours ago, THEWIZARD said:

Yeah let's sign our QB to a half a biliion dollar contract, then trade our Pro Bowl LT for a #2 WR. Sounds like a plan. A bad one but a plan nonetheless

We all know "Pro Bowl" voting is a joke. Brown Jr. was the 4th best lineman on the team this year behind Thuney, Creed, and Tre Smith, does anyone dispute that? lets not act like Brown Jr. is some kind of god tier Trent Williams style LT here.

if he was trent williams i would be saying pay him whatever he wants.

lets not forget a receiving corps of for example, Tyreek, Kelce, Metcalf, Hardmin, Juju. Someone is going to be instantly open darn near every play which lowers/ eliminates QB hits.

also, if our QB was Tom Brady and had zero mobility i would be all for spending whatever it takes on the O Line. fact of the matter is mahomes is gonna escape the pocket no matter what, i don't see the reason to pay top dollar to make a pocket.

that doesn't mean i want to roll out a 1 million dollar LT and RT like we did in the superbowl, but that means someone like Joseph Noteboom for 8 mil or draft a rookie. and if those options fail Thuney CAN play LT and we can plug and play a left guard.

im not saying everyone here is wrong about choosing to pay a LT to keep mahomes upright. But the idea that "Brown is a stud PRO BOWL 1st round talent gives up zero pressures per season" player is what is blowing my mind.

and with that i digress for the time being

[Iluvhouse24 1,808]

19 minutes ago, CranjisMcbasketball said:

We all know "Pro Bowl" voting is a joke. PFF (and i admit pff kinda sucks now) rated him as the 55th best OT this season. Brown Jr. was the 4th best lineman on the team this year behind Thuney, Creed, and Tre Smith, does anyone dispute that? lets not act like Brown Jr. is some kind of god tier Trent Williams style LT here.

if he was trent williams i would be saying pay him whatever he wants.

55th rated OT? Let me guess. You arent a PFF subscriber, but you went and looked at the limited grades they have available for non subscribers. Then you scrolled down the list and saw that Browns name was listed 55th. 

What you didn't pay attention to were some of the names in front of him. Cam Erving is the 10th name on the list. He had an overall grade of 56.0 this year. Does that sound like the 10th rated OT in all of football?

After the top 3, the rankings are not listed in any particular order for non subscribers.

And once again your argument is shot to hell. 

55th rated OT...🤣🤣🤣

[CranjisMcbasketball 780]

5 minutes ago, Iluvhouse24 said:

55th rated OT? 

NFL T Position Grades | PFF

you can look for yourself to make sure im not misreading.

One thing i found interesting is Alejandro Villanueva is rated #11. The Baltimore Ravens literally did the exact thing i am suggesting last season. They dealt Orlando for picks instead of giving him a mega deal, and signed Villanueva on the cheap to replace him until they are able to find a better permanent option.

[Iluvhouse24 1,808]

Just now, CranjisMcbasketball said:

NFL T Position Grades | PFF

you can look for yourself to make sure im not misreading.

One thing i found interesting is Alejandro Villanueva is rated #11. The Baltimore Ravens literally did the exact thing i am suggesting last season. They dealt Orlando for picks instead of giving him a mega deal, and signed Villanueva on the cheap to replace him until they are able to find a better permanent option.

See above.

[CranjisMcbasketball 780]

31 minutes ago, Iluvhouse24 said:

See above.

ok thanks. thats why i asked for someone else to look because it seemed suspicious. 

[CranjisMcbasketball 780]

my point that Brown jr has a PFF score of 75.2 and will be making 20 mil this year, vs Villanueva having 65.2 grade and will be making 3.25 mil this season is my general point though. anywho, have a good evening everyone

[THEWIZARD 247]

2 hours ago, CranjisMcbasketball said:

We all know "Pro Bowl" voting is a joke. Brown Jr. was the 4th best lineman on the team this year behind Thuney, Creed, and Tre Smith, does anyone dispute that? lets not act like Brown Jr. is some kind of god tier Trent Williams style LT here.

if he was trent williams i would be saying pay him whatever he wants.

lets not forget a receiving corps of for example, Tyreek, Kelce, Metcalf, Hardmin, Juju. Someone is going to be instantly open darn near every play which lowers/ eliminates QB hits.

also, if our QB was Tom Brady and had zero mobility i would be all for spending whatever it takes on the O Line. fact of the matter is mahomes is gonna escape the pocket no matter what, i don't see the reason to pay top dollar to make a pocket.

that doesn't mean i want to roll out a 1 million dollar LT and RT like we did in the superbowl, but that means someone like Joseph Noteboom for 8 mil or draft a rookie. and if those options fail Thuney CAN play LT and we can plug and play a left guard.

im not saying everyone here is wrong about choosing to pay a LT to keep mahomes upright. But the idea that "Brown is a stud PRO BOWL 1st round talent gives up zero pressures per season" player is what is blowing my mind.

and with that i digress for the time being

And once again Brown was in a new system with new starters at every position. He got substantially better at the end of the season. That point you made about Thuney and Smith doesn't really hold water. I'm pretty sure that LT is a LITTLE more difficult than playing guard. That's why when a team drafts a LT and they don't work out they move him inside a lot of the time. See Robert Gallery, among others.

You need to look at the big picture. KC is going to have one of the best lines in the league  next year, and trading away a quality player at a premium position for a 3rd option receiver makes no sense IMO. ESPECIALLY when you factor in the money he'll want

 

[sith13 1,746]

5 hours ago, CranjisMcbasketball said:

my point that Brown jr has a PFF score of 75.2 and will be making 20 mil this year, vs Villanueva having 65.2 grade and will be making 3.25 mil this season is my general point though. anywho, have a good evening everyone

Concerns about Brown at LT doesn't justify trading him for a WR though. It may be a good reason to not extend him but then the smart way would be to keep him on the tag for this year and see if he'll be worth the extension or try to trade him next year. If he's really crap Seattle wouldn't do the trade so it doesn't make any sense on that regard either as they would have to pay him more than Metcalf would cost.

If Brown is actually worth the trade then it doesn't make sense to let a decent LT leave for a WR unless there's actually a surplus at the position, which we don't have. Besides Metcalf or whomever comes in will be #3 in targets (or #4 depending on who the RB is) and likely have pedestrian stats that doesn't really justify giving up assets. 

[Docbarnabee 225]

DK Metcalf would be a very hard no.   He is more of an outside receiver.  Chiefs generally prefer  to utilize receivers differently.  I just do not think he fits our offense that well.   For a 1st and 3rd,  I just do not think the juice is worth the squeeze. 

[KC Warpaint 3,234]

3 hours ago, Docbarnabee said:

DK Metcalf would be a very hard no.   He is more of an outside receiver.  Chiefs generally prefer  to utilize receivers differently.  I just do not think he fits our offense that well.   For a 1st and 3rd,  I just do not think the juice is worth the squeeze. 

now if we are having this conversation about Lockett then i may be interested

[sith13 1,746]

1 hour ago, KC Warpaint said:

now if we are having this conversation about Lockett then i may be interested

I think it would again depend on the price. He's more of a better fit into our style of offense but also would cost some draft capital which may not be as meaningful. However if you are referring just to the style of play even though I think Metcalf would also be a good option Lockett definitely fits better.

[xen 1,010,220]

Lockett basically on a 2 year contract with reasonable numbers before cap hit for us would hit 20m the last 2 years, currently 4 years on the deal left.  There is an out in 2 years.

DK on last year of rookie contract and would cost an awful lot. Market value around 20m per.

We need an X.  Lockett more a Z or slot but could adapt I'm sure.  He'll also be 30 for this season.

[Thegoatee 1,780]

15 hours ago, xen said:

A slow slot receiver?  

I mean, we have lots of slot options and no X receiver, but I guess.

Those dudes racked up numbers as a safety valve and supreme route runner. We need someone who can exploit the middle other than Kelce. We also need a big, traditional WR. Metcalf strikes me as overrated.

[Calichief 3,016]

 Brown was a stud the last half of the year 

[xen 1,010,220]

13 hours ago, CranjisMcbasketball said:

my point that Brown jr has a PFF score of 75.2 and will be making 20 mil this year, vs Villanueva having 65.2 grade and will be making 3.25 mil this season is my general point though. anywho, have a good evening everyone

Villaneuva also led the league in sacks given up (17 vs 4 for OBJ), had a horrible year, and just retired.

[CranjisMcbasketball 780]

1 hour ago, xen said:

Villaneuva also led the league in sacks given up (17 vs 4 for OBJ), had a horrible year, and just retired.

LOL. obviously that did not work out for the ravens. i was just pointing out the ravens, which many think are a well run franchise. did do this.

in Villaneuva's defense he was suppose to be RT and because the ravens stud LT went down with injury he had to switch sides, but yeah you are right this did not work out for the ravens.

[Lamardirts 2,114]

16 hours ago, CranjisMcbasketball said:

my point that Brown jr has a PFF score of 75.2 and will be making 20 mil this year, vs Villanueva having 65.2 grade and will be making 3.25 mil this season is my general point though. anywho, have a good evening everyone

Villanueva had a 65 overall in a run heavy offense.   Brown had a 75 in a super heavy pass offense.   That number isn't as close as you think it is.  Villanueva was straight garbage last year.   Brown got better as the year went on.  If Mahomes reigns in his deep drops that number will go up for Brown.   The fact this Oline did as well as it did in their first year together and it had two rookies.  Can't imagine how good they are going to look with a full offseason together.   Pay the man and move on.   Trying to find a one year stop game restricts overall continuity and growth on the oline.  You are eventually going to have to pay a good OT big money.  Pay Orlando now and it will look like a bargain in two years.   

[Lamardirts 2,114]

Sign Juju and use the 1st or 2nd round pick on a wr.   Juju isn't a world beater but he is not afraid to go over the middle and is a big upgrade over what we had.   The rookie is a depth and gives him a year to learn and Mecole is a bonus. 

[CranjisMcbasketball 780]

1 minute ago, Lamardirts said:

Sign Juju and use the 1st or 2nd round pick on a wr.   Juju isn't a world beater but he is not afraid to go over the middle and is a big upgrade over what we had.   The rookie is a depth and gives him a year to learn and Mecole is a bonus. 

I would be fine with this. I think we agree more than disagree. My whole point is for the fans to be open minded about possibilities.

my plan would be essentially to sign juju at wr and joseph noteboom at ot. Keep brown on franchise tag for now.

this gives us options. If some team is desperate for an OT and offer two firsts for brown we can slide noteboom to LT and maybe have Wiley RT again. 
 

if we keep brown noteboom would be a stud RT and we can draft a WR 

Brown isn’t the end of the world at LT, I recognize he is solid, i am just so tired of these eric berry, hitchens, frank clark type contracts i want to avoid at all costs giving non elite players contracts we can’t move off of

[moons314 2,463]

On 3/9/2022 at 12:03 AM, sith13 said:

I don't like the move. Great WR but still the #3 option on the team, that would be too much investment for the outcome. IMO just go for a free agent that won't cost any picks.

He wouldn't be the #3 option on this team.  Kelce and Hill combined for 203 catches last year.  If you take Robinson's 25 catches, add that to it to get to 228, and divide it between Hill, Metcalf and Kelce, you could still have all 3 with 75+ receptions without big drops in yardage.  Simply keeping the defense from being able to double our existing 2 is an unquantifiable variable that would make him much more than the 3rd option.  Honestly, IF the Chiefs did get him, I think the long run in this scenario, Hill and Metcalf would be 1a/1b and Kelce would be 2.  Kelce and Hardman would be the biggest beneficiaries of Metcalf.