Hypothetical Trade for DK Metcalf

[Okiechief1 425]

1 hour ago, kkuenn said:

Some of these so called 2nd tier guys would be 1st tier in a lot of other years. WR is that deep.

I'm not a draft guru like some on here are but i did hear one of the talking heads say this draft is deep enough that you will see guys taken in the 5th that in most years would go in the 3rd.  

I'm really kinda hoping that of those first 6 picks in rounds 1-3, 2 of them are used on WRs.  With only 1 WR under contract for next n no guarantee that Hardman or JJS return I'm sure Mahomes would like some continuity in the WRs going into next year and the best way to do it is the draft.  Preferably 1 of the first round picks n another in the 3rd. 

[dhitter 1,424]

Would take Williams in a trade up scenario in a heartbeat. My fear is he may go higher than what we can offer unless we give up both firsts and I really don't want to do that.

[Balto 723]

What I'd look at if I was Veach

Metcalf:

Best I'll offer is #29+3rd rounder and Hardman

Then offer Metcalf a 4 year $100M "Extension", Media and such would call this a $25/Y signing but actually with his last year rookie pay of $4M this contract would be a 5 year $104M that avgs out to $20.8M a year.  This would also setup DK for another big contract at only 29.

 

OR

 

Williams:

#29+3rd and Hardman if need be, to move up and draft him

 

I think Hardman is gone after this year and he has the most trade value ATM so why not take it.

 

I'd be fine with either Metcalf(Who I personally think fits Mahomes game much better than Hill anyways).  Or Williams trade if Veach wants to save Cap room. 

[sith13 1,746]

On 4/8/2022 at 8:04 PM, Balto said:

What I'd look at if I was Veach

Metcalf:

Best I'll offer is #29+3rd rounder and Hardman

Then offer Metcalf a 4 year $100M "Extension", Media and such would call this a $25/Y signing but actually with his last year rookie pay of $4M this contract would be a 5 year $104M that avgs out to $20.8M a year.  This would also setup DK for another big contract at only 29.

 

OR

 

Williams:

#29+3rd and Hardman if need be, to move up and draft him

 

I think Hardman is gone after this year and he has the most trade value ATM so why not take it.

 

I'd be fine with either Metcalf(Who I personally think fits Mahomes game much better than Hill anyways).  Or Williams trade if Veach wants to save Cap room. 

What makes you think Hardman has any trade value? As fans of the Chiefs we like seeing some pulse but that's still optimism for the future rather than an immediate value. For anyone outside the organization he's probably a guy who could be swapped for their own failed experiment or a conditional pick at this point. 

[Lamardirts 2,114]

5 hours ago, sith13 said:

What makes you think Hardman has any trade value? As fans of the Chiefs we like seeing some pulse but that's still optimism for the future rather than an immediate value. For anyone outside the organization he's probably a guy who could be swapped for their own failed experiment or a conditional pick at this point. 

I think he has more value to others than to our fan base.  His numbers last year aren’t bad as the third option.  The tape will show him open more than we think.  I think Mahomes doesn’t trust him or his numbers would be better.  The last 4 games of the season he looked better.  I’m not saying teams see him as a #1 or #2 but he is a weapon.   I personally don’t want to see him included.  His speed and MVS’s speed give us two deep options and we need at least two.   
 

If we trade up, imo, it has to be for edge unless it is to jump GB with a lesser package.  
 

I also am curious who they see as their #1 wr.   Seems like the Garrett Wilson report and possibly the Pickens invite might be smoke.  Could it be those guys or are so they like Burks or Olive.    I wouldn’t mind any of those too guys but I worry that we reach for Watson’s athleticism.  Guy is super raw and drops a ton of balls and runs a limited route tree……..love his potential but that is way to risky for me.  

[sith13 1,746]

11 minutes ago, Lamardirts said:

I think he has more value to others than to our fan base.  His numbers last year aren’t bad as the third option.  The tape will show him open more than we think.  I think Mahomes doesn’t trust him or his numbers would be better.  The last 4 games of the season he looked better.  I’m not saying teams see him as a #1 or #2 but he is a weapon.   I personally don’t want to see him included.  His speed and MVS’s speed give us two deep options and we need at least two.   
 

If we trade up, imo, it has to be for edge unless it is to jump GB with a lesser package.  
 

I also am curious who they see as their #1 wr.   Seems like the Garrett Wilson report and possibly the Pickens invite might be smoke.  Could it be those guys or are so they like Burks or Olive.    I wouldn’t mind any of those too guys but I worry that we reach for Watson’s athleticism.  Guy is super raw and drops a ton of balls and runs a limited route tree……..love his potential but that is way to risky for me.  

The question I have is what would you consider Hardman's value in terms of a draft pick if you were another team/GM? When we put him in the equation is that similar to an extra 3rd, 4th, 5th, etc? 

At this point I don't think any GM would give up a pick in the first 4 rounds for Hardman, he's definitely not worth it. May be a 5th or 6th would be our best bet. In that case I don't see the value in trading him away either. His market value is much less than his raw skills that we could potentially utilize. If not then we just lose a late round pick value in the process which is acceptable IMO. 

At this point I can't really pin any prospect as WR1 for the Chiefs. I think our best bet is a Hill-type rookie season with a role that resembles WR2 and hopefully that prospect turns into WR1 in 2023. Watson is a realistic target but I would feel much better with that pick if we spent a 2nd on him. Burks is my favorite option considering the picks we have, good combination of size and speed that will create separation either way. I don't see him setting the world on fire in 2022 but he could emerge as the leader among our receivers if he doesn't end up in that "takes time to learn this system" cr@p we have to deal with for all rookies. 

[Balto 723]

25 minutes ago, sith13 said:

The question I have is what would you consider Hardman's value in terms of a draft pick if you were another team/GM? When we put him in the equation is that similar to an extra 3rd, 4th, 5th, etc? 

At this point I don't think any GM would give up a pick in the first 4 rounds for Hardman, he's definitely not worth it. May be a 5th or 6th would be our best bet. In that case I don't see the value in trading him away either. His market value is much less than his raw skills that we could potentially utilize. If not then we just lose a late round pick value in the process which is acceptable IMO. 

At this point I can't really pin any prospect as WR1 for the Chiefs. I think our best bet is a Hill-type rookie season with a role that resembles WR2 and hopefully that prospect turns into WR1 in 2023. Watson is a realistic target but I would feel much better with that pick if we spent a 2nd on him. Burks is my favorite option considering the picks we have, good combination of size and speed that will create separation either way. I don't see him setting the world on fire in 2022 but he could emerge as the leader among our receivers if he doesn't end up in that "takes time to learn this system" cr@p we have to deal with for all rookies. 

GMs, including ours, like to think they can bring in former 1st/2nd round guys and get more out of them.  Hardman is added to a trade because it “pushes” it over the top to get it done.  I’m about 99% sure Hardman will go FA next year and maybe we get a comp pick depending on who we sign blah blah blah but why not grab that value from in now if he’s that over the top addition that gets us Metcalf or a elite rookie who ever Veach likes.

Oh, “His market value is much less than his raw skills that we could potentially utilize”.  We would of utilized it by now…..

[sith13 1,746]

Just now, Balto said:

GMs, including ours, like to think they can bring in former 1st/2nd round guys and get more out of them.  Hardman is added to a trade because it “pushes” it over the top to get it done.  I’m about 99% sure Hardman will go FA next year and maybe we get a comp pick depending on who we sign blah blah blah but why not grab that value from in now if he’s that over the top addition that gets us Metcalf or a elite rookie who ever Veach likes.

Oh, “His market value is much less than his raw skills that we could potentially utilize”.  We would of utilized it by now…..

We have already been utilizing some of his raw skills. He has been a decent runner out of the backfield in those weird plays and has been useful in creating speed mismatches later in 2021. I don't see any GM giving up picks for that but they are still useful when he's already on the roster. I don't see us keeping him around for those raw skills after his contract runs out though. 

[Lamardirts 2,114]

4 hours ago, sith13 said:

We have already been utilizing some of his raw skills. He has been a decent runner out of the backfield in those weird plays and has been useful in creating speed mismatches later in 2021. I don't see any GM giving up picks for that but they are still useful when he's already on the roster. I don't see us keeping him around for those raw skills after his contract runs out though. 

He looked good down the stretch.  If you watch the film he was open quite a bit and either Mahomes didn't see him or ignored him.   This is coming from a guy who doesn't like Hardman.   I'm not saying he is worth a lot but he does have value.  His speed alone is enticing.   I would think a 4th or end of the 3rd round would be fair.

I mean Christian Kirk's stats are very similar and the dude got paid.  I'm not saying Mecole is Kirk but he isn't way far off and he was the main target when DH went down last year.  Mecole has never been the #1 option for any period.   

I do think he is more valuable to us than another team.   He is a deep threat and he is entering year 4 with the Chiefs.   He is also cheap.   

 

[xen 1,010,220]

2 hours ago, Lamardirts said:

He looked good down the stretch.  If you watch the film he was open quite a bit and either Mahomes didn't see him or ignored him.   This is coming from a guy who doesn't like Hardman.   I'm not saying he is worth a lot but he does have value.  His speed alone is enticing.   I would think a 4th or end of the 3rd round would be fair.

I mean Christian Kirk's stats are very similar and the dude got paid.  I'm not saying Mecole is Kirk but he isn't way far off and he was the main target when DH went down last year.  Mecole has never been the #1 option for any period.   

I do think he is more valuable to us than another team.   He is a deep threat and he is entering year 4 with the Chiefs.   He is also cheap.   

 

Mecole definitely has more value than Chiefs fans think.  Now nobody thinks Kirk was worth what they paid but speed kills and he has it in spades.

[AFCWEST 1,238]

UGH. Use the picks for defense please. No receiver is a sure thing so take a couple later. Seems that Hill guy was a late pick. We dont need another Hardman or CEH reach. Both players are good but not worth their position in the draft. KC needs some pass rushers that can contribute NOW.

Current. Safety weaker than last year, corner weaker than last year, pass rush even worse than last year, d-line weaker than last year. Chiefs need some big time draft picks on D. 

[xen 1,010,220]

58 minutes ago, AFCWEST said:

UGH. Use the picks for defense please. No receiver is a sure thing so take a couple later. Seems that Hill guy was a late pick. We dont need another Hardman or CEH reach. Both players are good but not worth their position in the draft. KC needs some pass rushers that can contribute NOW.

Current. Safety weaker than last year, corner weaker than last year, pass rush even worse than last year, d-line weaker than last year. Chiefs need some big time draft picks on D. 

No player is a sure thing period.  The ends that will be available will all have question marks.  Same for the DBs.  Let's please not pretend that all the offensive guys are busts waiting to happen and all the D players available are future all pros.  

[sith13 1,746]

8 hours ago, AFCWEST said:

UGH. Use the picks for defense please. No receiver is a sure thing so take a couple later. Seems that Hill guy was a late pick. We dont need another Hardman or CEH reach. Both players are good but not worth their position in the draft. KC needs some pass rushers that can contribute NOW.

Current. Safety weaker than last year, corner weaker than last year, pass rush even worse than last year, d-line weaker than last year. Chiefs need some big time draft picks on D. 

No player is a sure thing but I understand the need for prioritization. I also believe the marginal gain on some positions on offense is much smaller than defense but the goal is to create a balanced team that will compete so the availability of some players later in the draft will help determine each pick as well.

 

[DieHard 2,061]

On 4/8/2022 at 12:04 PM, Balto said:

What I'd look at if I was Veach

Metcalf:

Best I'll offer is #29+3rd rounder and Hardman

Then offer Metcalf a 4 year $100M "Extension", Media and such would call this a $25/Y signing but actually with his last year rookie pay of $4M this contract would be a 5 year $104M that avgs out to $20.8M a year.  This would also setup DK for another big contract at only 29.

 

OR

 

Williams:

#29+3rd and Hardman if need be, to move up and draft him

 

I think Hardman is gone after this year and he has the most trade value ATM so why not take it.

 

I'd be fine with either Metcalf(Who I personally think fits Mahomes game much better than Hill anyways).  Or Williams trade if Veach wants to save Cap room. 

We could trade a 1st, a 3rd and the guy we drafted ahead of DK and then still pay DK FA money.  Or... we could take turns kicking each other in the nuts for an hour. Same thing.

[AFCWEST 1,238]

15 hours ago, xen said:

No player is a sure thing period.  The ends that will be available will all have question marks.  Same for the DBs.  Let's please not pretend that all the offensive guys are busts waiting to happen and all the D players available are future all pros.  

Never stated that and yes nothing is for certain. I think its easier to find a decent receiver later than a potential very needed defense upgrade. 

[Balto 723]

I wonder if Seattle would like the idea of our 2023 1st instead of 29 or 30 this year?  They currently have 2 1st round picks for next years draft and with the need of a QB plus next years QB stock is said to be much better than this year, will they try to load up for 2023 so they have ammo to trade up if need be for a QB?

2023 1st+3rd this year+Hardman

 

I like this and Seattle actually might like this as well.

[mex 65,581]

On 4/11/2022 at 8:48 PM, xen said:

No player is a sure thing period.  The ends that will be available will all have question marks.  Same for the DBs.  Let's please not pretend that all the offensive guys are busts waiting to happen and all the D players available are future all pros.  

That ain't no shit.

We're batting about .400 on first round DL selections since 2000.

And that's with much higher picks than #29.