How Can KC Become a Dynasty over the next 5-10 years?

[xen 1,010,220]

4 hours ago, AFCWEST said:

Its a conversation. A discussion. Its how to.

And I was discussing how a bunch of people overreact on this board way too much through the wonderful medium of smartassery.

[robgar 1,046]

theres no over reaction on this board.. 

4 days after a very physical game, the big guys didnt play up to par.. 

a week after that,  there back on track, and punching people in the mouth again. 

I just think the physicality of the chargers game, followed by a thursday game was the problem. 

it would of been hard for any team.. 

[AFCWEST 1,238]

Everyone knows how much of a force Chris Jones can be and this season has been no different as he currently holds the second-highest PFF grade among defensive tackles with an elite 90.8 mark. He’s behind just Jeffery Simmons and Aaron Donald with 15 pressures on the year and ranks second with an 83.5 run defense grade.

Part of the problem with Jones is he rarely lines up in the same spot consistently. Out of 213 defensive snaps, he’s line up as a left defensive tackle or end about 37.6 percent of the time while playing on the right side for the other 62-ish percent of snaps. So, while he favors the right over the left, Jones will flip around and be able to attack an opponent’s weakest offensive lineman.

[dhitter 1,424]

The Chiefs are a dominant LT and DE away from being THE team in the NFL. Problem is....of all the positions on the team, those are a couple that really require a high draft pick in order to ensure best chance of success if you build through the draft. Otherwise you have to go trade/FA route. I like Karlaftis. But does anyone see him becoming a 12-15 sack a season guy? I don't. 

[oldtimer 8,686]

22 minutes ago, dhitter said:

The Chiefs are a dominant LT and DE away from being THE team in the NFL. Problem is....of all the positions on the team, those are a couple that really require a high draft pick in order to ensure best chance of success if you build through the draft. Otherwise you have to go trade/FA route. I like Karlaftis. But does anyone see him becoming a 12-15 sack a season guy? I don't. 

agreed he's no RDPOTY candidate like Micah Parsons or Bosa but then he wasn't the 12th or 2nd pick either

[jetlord 10,209]

2 hours ago, dhitter said:

The Chiefs are a dominant LT and DE away from being THE team in the NFL. Problem is....of all the positions on the team, those are a couple that really require a high draft pick in order to ensure best chance of success if you build through the draft. Otherwise you have to go trade/FA route. I like Karlaftis. But does anyone see him becoming a 12-15 sack a season guy? I don't. 

I think the Chiefs need a LT, RT, DE, and #1 WR to become solid at every position group.  No team has 22 above average starters but the Chiefs could come close.  Maybe Niang could develop and stay healthy.  Maybe Ross could become a factor next year.  Maybe Kinnard could take ballet lessons?  If OBJ doesn't turn it around and the Chiefs let him go, they could have cap room to sign a top tier FA.

[Lamardirts 2,114]

Veach has hit home runs on back to back drafts.  He needs to hit on this upcoming draft for the Chiefs to have a really good chance of becoming a dynasty.   We have filled and plugged most of the holes on this team with young affordable depth.   The key positions next offseason will be WR#1, LT, & DE.   All premium position pieces.   We could always bring back Brown at the right price which is probably the best options for solidifying our oline for a dynasty run.   Where we draft makes finding a stud DE is going to be difficult so that would be the position I might try again via trade.  I think we have a better shot at drafting a stud WR at the back end of the first or in the 2nd.   

Even if all that fails we still have a good chance because we have Mahomes.

 

[Lamardirts 2,114]

3 hours ago, dhitter said:

The Chiefs are a dominant LT and DE away from being THE team in the NFL. Problem is....of all the positions on the team, those are a couple that really require a high draft pick in order to ensure best chance of success if you build through the draft. Otherwise you have to go trade/FA route. I like Karlaftis. But does anyone see him becoming a 12-15 sack a season guy? I don't. 

He's this generations version of Tamba Hali.  High motor guy that needs a 12 sack guy across from him to become a +10 sack guy.  Maybe I'm wrong.  I love where we got him in the draft and he is already an upgrade but we really need that "it" guy for Spags D to really shine.  

[Lamardirts 2,114]

3 hours ago, dhitter said:

The Chiefs are a dominant LT and DE away from being THE team in the NFL. Problem is....of all the positions on the team, those are a couple that really require a high draft pick in order to ensure best chance of success if you build through the draft. Otherwise you have to go trade/FA route. I like Karlaftis. But does anyone see him becoming a 12-15 sack a season guy? I don't. 

I would change that to DE and WR#1.   I think OBJ is sufficient.  Dude is playing hurt right now.  I don't think he is elite or great but he is a top 10-12 LT and if we could pay him like one that would be good enough.

[AFCWEST 1,238]

38 minutes ago, Lamardirts said:

I would change that to DE and WR#1.   I think OBJ is sufficient.  Dude is playing hurt right now.  I don't think he is elite or great but he is a top 10-12 LT and if we could pay him like one that would be good enough.

PAYING Brown top dollars will not move this team into Dynasty. It will still take up too much cap space. He is average in my eye. No money for Jones? Kelce will need a new deal? Move up and draft a LT. 

[Lamardirts 2,114]

7 hours ago, AFCWEST said:

PAYING Brown top dollars will not move this team into Dynasty. It will still take up too much cap space. He is average in my eye. No money for Jones? Kelce will need a new deal? Move up and draft a LT. 

Um Kelce is locked up until 2025.   Locking up a LT now makes more financial sense than waiting for the new tv deals to hit.  You think 18 million a year for an above avg LT is expensive now....just wait a year or two.  How much are you gonna have to spend to move up and get a starting caliber LT?  Probably a 1,2 & 3.  That is three players you are trading for someone who may never even be as good as OBJ. I'll take the known commodity when it comes to protecting Mahomes.  I'd rather use those 3 picks to grab a WR, DE, & RT.  CJ is locked up this year and next.   Not sure you will be able to extend him as he will probably want to hit FA again at around 30, nor should we overpay him even though he is an elite player.    

The truth is this new phase is going to take us to the end of CJ and Kelce's career here in KC.   It sucks but you can't build a dynasty holding onto guys when they get long in the tooth.   Of the two, Kelce has taken team friendly deals and would be the exception.

[CranjisMcbasketball 780]

First steps toward becoming the 3 win superbowl team that we should have been over the last 5 years.

1. no way in hell give orlando brown money

2. move on from eb and toub on the coaching staff

3. throw numbers in the draft at wr to give mahomes at least one legit weapon and preferably two (fill the bottom end with Justin watson type receivers)

4. Thuney + Creed + Smith at the interior line plus average tackles should be good enough to compete over the next few seasons, at the moment our tackles are being payed to be below average.

5. stop wasting 1st round picks on things like CEH at rb, trading for frank clark, etc.

6. stop wasting cap dollars on defensive guys who aren’t elite (clark, hitchens, matheui), draft athletic upside with fresh legs and coach them to play fast. No more using veterns because the scheme is too complex to learn (bob sutton)

 

this team is and has been so close to being unstoppable. The Reid + Mahomes combo gets you 85% of the way there in and of itself, chris jones being elite on the interior gets you another 5% closer. Its the remaining 10% of the decisions that have been botched lately, but its still a damn good organization.

[arthur75 415]

Some of the decisions they have made have not panned out the way I would of thought. I thought JUJU would be a difference maker and I thought Hardman might jump up in production. As of right now I am wrong on both fronts. Clark is well lets be honest maybe good enough to be a backup (tops) MVS is a #3 or 4 WR at best, The strength of this team is at the Head coach position QB and offensive line. (besides the hiccup at Indy) Are they superbowl contenders-- sure any team can get on a run. But as far as dynasty? not sure

[AFCWEST 1,238]

7 minutes ago, arthur75 said:

Some of the decisions they have made have not panned out the way I would of thought. I thought JUJU would be a difference maker and I thought Hardman might jump up in production. As of right now I am wrong on both fronts. Clark is well lets be honest maybe good enough to be a backup (tops) MVS is a #3 or 4 WR at best, The strength of this team is at the Head coach position QB and offensive line. (besides the hiccup at Indy) Are they superbowl contenders-- sure any team can get on a run. But as far as dynasty? not sure

The question was how can? It was not why not? LOL

[oldtimer 8,686]

1 hour ago, CranjisMcbasketball said:

First steps toward becoming the 3 win superbowl team that we should have been over the last 5 years.

1. no way in hell give orlando brown money

2. move on from eb and toub on the coaching staff

3. throw numbers in the draft at wr to give mahomes at least one legit weapon and preferably two (fill the bottom end with Justin watson type receivers)

4. Thuney + Creed + Smith at the interior line plus average tackles should be good enough to compete over the next few seasons, at the moment our tackles are being payed to be below average.

5. stop wasting 1st round picks on things like CEH at rb, trading for frank clark, etc.

6. stop wasting cap dollars on defensive guys who aren’t elite (clark, hitchens, matheui), draft athletic upside with fresh legs and coach them to play fast. No more using veterns because the scheme is too complex to learn (bob sutton)

 

this team is and has been so close to being unstoppable. The Reid + Mahomes combo gets you 85% of the way there in and of itself, chris jones being elite on the interior gets you another 5% closer. Its the remaining 10% of the decisions that have been botched lately, but its still a damn good organization.

 

9 minutes ago, arthur75 said:

Some of the decisions they have made have not panned out the way I would of thought. I thought JUJU would be a difference maker and I thought Hardman might jump up in production. As of right now I am wrong on both fronts. Clark is well lets be honest maybe good enough to be a backup (tops) MVS is a #3 or 4 WR at best, The strength of this team is at the Head coach position QB and offensive line. (besides the hiccup at Indy) Are they superbowl contenders-- sure any team can get on a run. But as far as dynasty? not sure

Every team makes gambles and makes mistakes. It appears to me Veach & co  maybe a better college talent evaluator than he is FA and that's ok. I'm sure  if I went back and looked at the CEH draft ther are players on other rosters that we'd WTF Veach where you thinking? but that's hindsight. IIRC that was time where there where some other QBs bemoaning the fact they where not consulted on certain players in the draft maybe it was a move to nip that in the bud and let Patrick pick? I don't see that happening again. I think rehashing that move is unproductive and back seat GMing but then that's what we do.

[arthur75 415]

38 minutes ago, AFCWEST said:

The question was how can? It was not why not? LOL

Let me try A different approach. Thru the draft. Basically a WR a true #1 WR, a game changing 10-15 sack DE and I think they have the players to make a run at a dynasty. I think 2 more superbowl wins and and A team that is always  in the conversation every year as the team to beat. They are so close so close just need a few more players. I would love Mahomes to pass Brady on Superbowls I just think he is so far the best QB I have ever seen.

[CranjisMcbasketball 780]

1 hour ago, oldtimer said:

 

Every team makes gambles and makes mistakes. It appears to me Veach & co  maybe a better college talent evaluator than he is FA and that's ok. I'm sure  if I went back and looked at the CEH draft ther are players on other rosters that we'd WTF Veach where you thinking? but that's hindsight. IIRC that was time where there where some other QBs bemoaning the fact they where not consulted on certain players in the draft maybe it was a move to nip that in the bud and let Patrick pick? I don't see that happening again. I think rehashing that move is unproductive and back seat GMing but then that's what we do.

I think the important lesson of the ceh pick is:

1. The chiefs had “loaded roster” and could afford to “waste” 1st round pick on a rb.

2. The chiefs  were in need of a rb on the roster

3. coming off a superbowl win they had good will to take a risk in the draft.

this was the PERFECT scenario to justify using a 1st on a rb, and the pick STILL sucked.

this isn’t a bash on veach, this is just something to put in our memory banks so that in 10 years when they discuss the possibility of a 1st or 2nd round rb again we know its stupid

[azchief21 5,278]

I think in today's NFL the days of 1st round RBs is dwindling. You look at Pacheco and CEH and you can't tell the difference between a 1st & 7th round pick except the size of the contract. Veach would take it back if he could. Lesson learned. Move on.

[qnet 1,150]

On 10/5/2022 at 12:23 PM, AFCWEST said:

Yes; I dont mind free agents. Chiefs gave Thuney big bucks. Its trading high picks for guys getting big contracts that costs cap space and future low contract possibly impact players. Veach has done well with most of his free agents.

I’ve got to go back and read the other points, but I just wanted to say I agree about not giving up draft picks. Moving up to draft Mahomes was the only time I can think of,  that was truly worth it. 

[jetlord 10,209]

3 hours ago, qnet said:

I’ve got to go back and read the other points, but I just wanted to say I agree about not giving up draft picks. Moving up to draft Mahomes was the only time I can think of,  that was truly worth it. 

Maybe this year?  McDuffie could turn out to be worth the move up.  

[jetlord 10,209]

4 hours ago, arthur75 said:

  They are so close so close just need a few more players.  

And half the teams in the league are saying the same thing.  How close are the Chargers?  The Bills?  Any team that has their long time "elite" QB is in the hunt if they can find just one or two more difference makers.  Bal?  Cinn?  Being a 10-13 win team would seem to be in the Chiefs future for several years.  Getting to, and winning, multiple SBs is longer odds. 

[arthur75 415]

53 minutes ago, jetlord said:

And half the teams in the league are saying the same thing.  How close are the Chargers?  The Bills?  Any team that has their long time "elite" QB is in the hunt if they can find just one or two more difference makers.  Bal?  Cinn?  Being a 10-13 win team would seem to be in the Chiefs future for several years.  Getting to, and winning, multiple SBs is longer odds. 

I diagree. I do not think too many other teams are one or 2 players away from being a dynasty. Maybe 1 or 2 away from superbowl but not dynasty. 

[AFCWEST 1,238]

2 minutes ago, arthur75 said:

I diagree. I do not think too many other teams are one or 2 players away from being a dynasty. Maybe 1 or 2 away from superbowl but not dynasty. 

No team, including KC is 2 or 3 players away from a dynasty. Why? Because roster turnover is guaranteed by the salary cap and free agency. Imagine Kelce getting injured or early retires? Injuries to star players change a team in a moment.

A few teams may be a few players away from one SB Win but dynasty not so much.

 

[xen 1,010,220]