Spags Article for Discussion : Changes on the way?

[AFCWEST 1,238]

Could Defensive Changes Be on the Horizon for the Chiefs?

There has been a narrative floating around that because the defense has so many young players, it doesn't reflect on Spagnuolo. Instead, it's just that the defense is too young right now. This couldn't be more wrong. Outside of Chris Jones, the best part of the defense has been those young players, specifically at cornerback. 

Trent McDuffie looks like a star in the making and the other two, Joshua Williams and Jaylen Watson, are playing at a solid level. If the argument is that Spagnuolo doesn't have enough vets, turn to the Chiefs' defenses from 2019-2021. The 2019-2021 defenses mainly had the same core players filled with veterans, and their numbers declined yearly.

 

https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/nfl/could-defensive-changes-be-on-the-horizon-for-the-chiefs/ar-AA15jIvW?

cvid=62b15ddfdb36403b8659950aabe5c694

 

The truth is that Spagnuolo's defensive style is no longer built to play in the current NFL. It has nothing to do with the age of the player and all to do with the type of player Spagnuolo prefers.

[AFCWEST 1,238]

Spagnuolo had his most success before the 2015 season. Since then, the NFL game has become more spread out and generally quicker. Typically, Spagnuolo has preferred bigger players on defense, specifically on the defensive line. The folks at the KCSN Laboratory have researched these preferences and concluded that there are three thresholds that Spagnuolo typically targets when looking for a defensive end: 

• Height - 6'3" or taller
• Weight - 260 pounds or more
• Arm Length - 33" or longer

The style of play of these players is typically power rushers who are strong against the run but struggle to bend the corner. The Chiefs struggle to get to the quarterback against offenses with mobile quarterbacks. The bigger, typical power rusher has difficulty catching up to the athletic quarterbacks. Those quarterbacks can evade the Chiefs' rush, putting more pressure on the defense's back end.

[AFCWEST 1,238]

Spagnuolo hasn't and isn't going to change his philosophy on the type of players he likes. If the Chiefs want a defense built to stop the NFL's modern offense, it's time to explore finding a different defensive coordinator for 2023. A changing of defensive coordinators would also put the spotlight on general manager Brett Veach.

Veach has been improving throughout his tenure with the Chiefs, but a new coordinator would technically be the third one under his watch without any top defenses stemming from the prior two. He will have to continue to draft good players and find a way to build a strong defense so the pressure isn't always on Patrick Mahomes and the offense to win games and championships. 

[oldtimer 8,686]

yawn

[kkuenn 3,597]

Just now, oldtimer said:

yawn

Fire veach!

[AFCWEST 1,238]

Just now, kkuenn said:

Fire veach!

I dont think the article is saying bad things about Veach. It points out how well the young guys are doing. I put the link in to read the entire article and highlighted part of it. Its worth the read.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/nfl/could-defensive-changes-be-on-the-horizon-for-the-chiefs/ar-AA15jIvW? cvid=62b15ddfdb36403b8659950aabe5c694

It makes the point that many have voiced here. No rush from the ends is and always has been an issue with Spags a DC.

I dont have a personal opinion yet. It makes some good points and shows that Spags has seldom had an above average defense.

[kkuenn 3,597]

Just now, AFCWEST said:

I dont think the article is saying bad things about Veach. It points out how well the young guys are doing. I put the link in to read the entire article and highlighted part of it. Its worth the read.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/nfl/could-defensive-changes-be-on-the-horizon-for-the-chiefs/ar-AA15jIvW? cvid=62b15ddfdb36403b8659950aabe5c694

It makes the point that many have voiced here. No rush from the ends is and always has been an issue with Spags a DC.

I dont have a personal opinion yet. It makes some good points and shows that Spags has seldom had an above average defense.

I was being facetious.

[AFCWEST 1,238]

Just now, kkuenn said:

I was being facetious.

Ok. So if KC were to change DC, I doubt Reid will go for that, Veach could then go for a different type of player/DE. Do you think that makes sense?

[AFCWEST 1,238]

Here are the DVOA rankings of everywhere Steve Spagnuolo has worked as the defensive coordinator or head coach:

• Giants DC 2007 - 14
• Giants DC 2008 - 8
• Rams HC 2009 - 31
• Rams HC 2010 - 15
• Rams HC 2011 - 17
• Saints DC 2012 - 27
• Giants DC 2015 - 27
• Giants DC 2016 - 3
• Giants DC 2017 - 25

[oldtimer 8,686]

I'd say if a better candidate shows it might be worth discussion but it is not as easy as it sounds to just change a D  Players are acquired to fit a scheme 3-4 or 4-3 D' takes time to change out and patience. Spags seems to be a well respected DC I dont see the next Buddy Ryan waiting to be snatched up  and Buddy Ryan like most coaches are only idiots or genius's because of their players. Veach does the shopping Spags has to cook

[Okiechief1 425]

Changing the DC isn't going to matter if the DL outside of jones is subpar.   Karlaftis will probably have better production next year.  Not oppsed to a change just its going to take more than a different DC to get consistent pressure from the front 4 and I'm not sure of DC now that could get pressure without blitzing with this line.  

Somehow if i think if they good edge rusher opposite Karlaftis just even an avg to above DL to go next to CJ,  those 2 positions will have the biggest impact 

[AFCWEST 1,238]

11 minutes ago, oldtimer said:

I'd say if a better candidate shows it might be worth discussion but it is not as easy as it sounds to just change a D  Players are acquired to fit a scheme 3-4 or 4-3 D' takes time to change out and patience. Spags seems to be a well respected DC I dont see the next Buddy Ryan waiting to be snatched up  and Buddy Ryan like most coaches are only idiots or genius's because of their players. Veach does the shopping Spags has to cook

Veach does the shopping Spags has to cook. Winner

So is Spags a short order cook or a gourmet chef?  

[artsy 1,137]

12 minutes ago, AFCWEST said:

Veach does the shopping Spags has to cook. Winner

So is Spags a short order cook or a gourmet chef?  

Im not a big Spags fan, but I'd have to say he is a gourmet chef. KC really hasn't had a lot of talent on Def since he's been here..CJ, Honeybadger and Frank Clark for one year..Yet the defense has played just good enough every now and then. However, I don't place all the blame on Veech for the lack of talent. 

I personally believe Veech gets the players Spags wants, per se. But it's hard to tell who's really responsible for the FA and draft picks veech gets. I mean Andy is responsible for bringing both of those guys in soooooooo...yea.

[AFCWEST 1,238]

3 minutes ago, artsy said:

Im not a big Spags fan, but I'd have to say he is a gourmet chef. KC really hasn't had a lot of talent on Def since he's been here..CJ, Honeybadger and Frank Clark for one year..Yet the defense has played just good enough every now and then. However, I don't place all the blame on Veech for the lack of talent. 

I personally believe Veech gets the players Spags wants, per se. But it's hard to tell who's really responsible for the FA and draft picks veech gets. I mean Andy is responsible for bringing both of those guys in soooooooo...yea.

No doubt Andy has input and final say. At the very least yes or no. I think Veach has done a really good job overall. Nobody can predict when a guy will become more focused on machine guns that game day. The Cap does work in the NFL. KC has put more money on offense and that makes sense.

I do wonder if the article point makes sense. No reason KC could not change player profiles and keep SPAGS. At this point looking for a different type of end would not change the D much. Maybe the attack plan. Does Spags love the blitz because he gets extra credit for calling the play? Is that his ego on display?

[oldtimer 8,686]

30 minutes ago, AFCWEST said:

Veach does the shopping Spags has to cook. Winner

So is Spags a short order cook or a gourmet chef?  

Gourmet Chefs can only do so much if they have McDonalds grade beef and 2nd hand french fries. That being said Chefs usually pick out their ingredients. I have had some damn fine meals in little diners and crappy meals in what might be rated a 4 or 5 star restaurant but to answer your question I'd say neither I'd say he's a camp cook which can mix and match  different ingredients and make it palatable not gonna win any awards but  good enough to clean your plate.

 His defense suffocated the at then undefeated juggernaut that was the Patriots in the SB..he's no greasy spoon cook

[AFCWEST 1,238]

1 minute ago, oldtimer said:

Gourmet Chefs can only do so much if they have McDonalds grade beef and 2nd hand french fries. That being said Chefs usually pick out their ingredients. I have had some damn fine meals in little diners and crappy meals in what might be rated a 4 or 5 star restaurant but to answer your question I'd say neither I'd say he's a camp cook which can mix and match  different ingredients and make it palatable not gonna win any awards but  good enough to clean your plate.

 His defense suffocated the at then undefeated juggernaut that was the Patriots in the SB..he's no greasy spoon cook

Sounds like THE RECIPE for Success.

[Thegoatee 1,780]

The defense hasn’t necessarily been bad this year to me. What they’ve failed to do is pressure the QB from the outside and force turnovers. Every game I see teams punching the ball out or picking off passes. KC is near the bottom of that. Frank Clark is an abysmal story for an edge rusher. I really think a lot starts and stops with his contract as far as sacks and pressure led interceptions. Punching the ball out speaks to the timidity of the players. Lot of arm tacklers and grabbers. No nasty guys. Bolton is about the only dude tackling with confidence.

[arthur75 415]

The Chiefs problems all stem from D-Line and O-line play.  D-line is soft as cotton and the o-line mainkt the tackles are barely average and thats being generous. You fix those problems this team wins the Superbowl. 

[dhitter 1,424]

I like Spags....just not a huge fan of how he sets the defense. I watched Charvarius Ward last night and he looked like a frickin' stud. He was decent for the Chiefs but he never looked like that. 

[kkuenn 3,597]

52 minutes ago, dhitter said:

I like Spags....just not a huge fan of how he sets the defense. I watched Charvarius Ward last night and he looked like a frickin' stud. He was decent for the Chiefs but he never looked like that. 

Up until this last game he had been targeted 69 times and allowed 42 receptions. For the kind of money he got from SF, I will gladly take the comp pick.

[dhitter 1,424]

On 12/16/2022 at 12:54 PM, kkuenn said:

Up until this last game he had been targeted 69 times and allowed 42 receptions. For the kind of money he got from SF, I will gladly take the comp pick.

I haven't followed the 49ers or Ward for that matter. He looked good in that game. Real good.

[Fmbl2187 2,279]

On 12/15/2022 at 10:44 AM, AFCWEST said:

Veach does the shopping Spags has to cook. Winner

So is Spags a short order cook or a gourmet chef?  

He is a lead chef at a Taco Bell. He is thinking of moving up to Domino's.