Report Says No Tag For Brown

[dhitter 1,424]

21 minutes ago, oldtimer said:

I dont think you'll see him get "stupid $$" unless possibly from the Bears but the Bears have enough  high draft picks  that they could draft one as well. It wil be interesting to see what he gets and by whom

Brown is the #1 OT in Free Agency (top 5 overall FA). Since LT is a pillar of any franchise, surely someone is gonna do something stupid. 😝

[Holmes4six! 968]

25 minutes ago, dhitter said:

Brown is the #1 OT in Free Agency (top 5 overall FA). Since LT is a pillar of any franchise, surely someone is gonna do something stupid. 😝

I don’t believe he will be back. Time for chiefs to move on. 
 

[sith13 1,746]

1 hour ago, dhitter said:

Brown is the #1 OT in Free Agency (top 5 overall FA). Since LT is a pillar of any franchise, surely someone is gonna do something stupid. 😝

His demands last year while not being the #1 option were quite high so as the #1 guy I'm guessing he'll want the world.

[jetlord 10,209]

3 hours ago, KC Warpaint said:

  whatever Veach is planning to do 

That's the key to the fan reaction.  Veach has hit a few home runs and fans trust that there's a plan in place.  After the already slim FA possibilities are gone, expect to see the nervous Nellies start their yipping about no one to play LT.  

[kkuenn 3,597]

42 minutes ago, jetlord said:

That's the key to the fan reaction.  Veach has hit a few home runs and fans trust that there's a plan in place.  After the already slim FA possibilities are gone, expect to see the nervous Nellies start their yipping about no one to play LT.  

Fire veach

[xen 1,010,220]

4 hours ago, dhitter said:

So last year OBJ was offered $139 million on a six year deal and he didn't like that?  He played on the tag as a "prove it" year and that is what he gave us?

Before anyone goes all "bat shit" crazy and retorts, "we won the frickin' Super Bowl and gave up no sacks!" There is a reason guys like Frank Clark and OBJ are gone. The 17 games leading up to the playoffs? You kinda have to play good in those too...right? Patrick Mahomes and Reid's play designs mask a lot of OBJ"s deficiencies... I'm curious to see which team pays Brown the "stupid money". 

I mean, I'm all for moving on but those numbers are not really what they were offering.  There was a ton of funny money for show in there and not much guaranteed.  The guarantees were where he was balking, not the totals.  

I agreed with Veach taking a hard line on this.  I think most of us get it.

[azchief21 5,278]

I'm done bashing Veach. Proved himself to me. If he gives OBJ a bag of cash. I'm good. If he let's him walk, I'm good. 

[dhitter 1,424]

4 hours ago, xen said:

I mean, I'm all for moving on but those numbers are not really what they were offering.  There was a ton of funny money for show in there and not much guaranteed.  The guarantees were where he was balking, not the totals.  

I agreed with Veach taking a hard line on this.  I think most of us get it.

Yes the amount of guaranteed money and the fact a lot was loaded into the back end of the deal. I get it. But given that Brown was average last year it was still a fair offer. The problems are that OBJ has been selected to 4 straight pro bowls (god only knows how), he is coming off a SB win and is hitting his prime years. I think in his mind he sees himself on the same level as a Trent Williams. He doesn't just want to cash in....he wants what he believes is a deal that reflects "respect." I'd be okay if he stayed ...but not by breaking the bank.

[xen 1,010,220]

1 minute ago, dhitter said:

Yes the amount of guaranteed money and the fact a lot was loaded into the back end of the deal. I get it. But given that Brown was average last year it was still a fair offer. The problems are that OBJ has been selected to 4 straight pro bowls (god only knows how), he is coming off a SB win and is hitting his prime years. He doesn't just want to cash in....he wants what he believes is a deal that reflects "respect." I'd be okay if he stayed ...but not by breaking the bank.

Both sides have a point.  Good left tackles get capital P paid, not just great ones, so he's probably right to bet on himself.  And KC won't and shouldn't overpay for a guy that's not great in our system.

[dhitter 1,424]

7 minutes ago, xen said:

Both sides have a point.  Good left tackles get capital P paid, not just great ones, so he's probably right to bet on himself.  And KC won't and shouldn't overpay for a guy that's not great in our system.

$20 plus million a year? How will he ever pay his car note! Lol... I guess we'll see whether or not someone overpays for him or whether we let him go when we shouldn't have.

[xen 1,010,220]

1 hour ago, dhitter said:

$20 plus million a year? How will he ever pay his car note! Lol... I guess we'll see whether or not someone overpays for him or whether we let him go when we shouldn't have.

Just because someone pays what he's asking has no bearing on whether we should have let him go.  There are quite a few run first teams he would dominate with.  That's just not us.

[DieHard 2,061]

Both years he seemed to struggle early and come on late. I would like to see him back, but not at any price. 

[Holmes4six! 968]

I like the idea of letting him go. We didn’t have many choices as the two tags priced out very high as well. 
few FA LT out there that would be cheaper and play at the same level I think. 
Can’t wait to see what Veach is gonna do. 
if we know one thing, he won’t fuck around protecting mahomes. 

[dhitter 1,424]

1 hour ago, xen said:

Just because someone pays what he's asking has no bearing on whether we should have let him go.  There are quite a few run first teams he would dominate with.  That's just not us.

Agree....I wasn't making that connection though although I can see how someone might connect those dots.

[sith13 1,746]

Lack of a tag already means there's not enough interest in trading for OBJ and making him one of the highest paid LTs in football. May be someone bites without the trade but even that will not be easy as his market value may be lower than what Chiefs offered last year. I guess we'll learn in a few days but the only thing going for OBJ is the lack of alternatives in FA. 

In our case the lack of a headache means just getting a 3rd in the process which is not that bad of a compensation. Consistently having extra picks in the draft is only going to help us build stronger by the year. 

[kkuenn 3,597]

1 hour ago, sith13 said:

Lack of a tag already means there's not enough interest in trading for OBJ and making him one of the highest paid LTs in football. May be someone bites without the trade but even that will not be easy as his market value may be lower than what Chiefs offered last year. I guess we'll learn in a few days but the only thing going for OBJ is the lack of alternatives in FA. 

In our case the lack of a headache means just getting a 3rd in the process which is not that bad of a compensation. Consistently having extra picks in the draft is only going to help us build stronger by the year. 

Not guaranteed a 3rd in comp though. If we pick up a good amount of FAs ourselves it could mean a lesser comp pick. Who knows though as they have never said what the formula is for the process. 

[sith13 1,746]

46 minutes ago, kkuenn said:

Not guaranteed a 3rd in comp though. If we pick up a good amount of FAs ourselves it could mean a lesser comp pick. Who knows though as they have never said what the formula is for the process. 

The formula may be the greatest mystery in the NFL. I remember Broncos signing a whole bunch of high priced FAs while getting decent picks in the process for whatever reason.

I'm assuming our lack of cap space will lead to a more modest FA shopping and if all OBJ, Wylie, and Hardman can land decent deals (and may be Juju) we should likely be in a very positive situation.

[jetlord 10,209]

10 hours ago, sith13 said:

The formula may be the greatest mystery in the NFL. I remember Broncos signing a whole bunch of high priced FAs while getting decent picks in the process for whatever reason.

I'm assuming our lack of cap space will lead to a more modest FA shopping and if all OBJ, Wylie, and Hardman can land decent deals (and may be Juju) we should likely be in a very positive situation.

Thornhill should get the Chiefs a comp pick.  He will be a starter for whoever signs him. 

[Lamardirts 2,114]

Its an important decision for sure but I would always hesitate signing an avg LT for top 4-5 money because you feel threatened or forced into that situation.   We aren't planning for one more SB run we are trying to position ourselves and set the precident that we will be SB contenders/favorites for the next 10 years.   Signing elite guys to elite money is fine, signing guys that are ranked 11-13 in the league at their position at top tier levels pretty much guarantees you losing an elite player down the road or shortening that SB window.  

Lets not pretend like OBJ was elite nor was he atrocious down the stretch but we had to game plan around his inability to stop speed rushers and if you are going to pay a LT 20 plus million they shouldn't need that help regularly.   Mahomes also makes our tackles stats look better.  No one knows this better than our OC, HC, and OL coach.  They see what we see and more and this is absolutely the correct call.  If someone wants to overpay let them,  we will be fine.   If his market is less than he thought we have the option to bring him back.   We have the ammo to move up and lock up a LT in the first, we can sign a one year vet or a couple looking for a ring and draft a LT at 31.  We could upgrade at RT and draft a LT.  Helping one side of the line is doable.  Shoot we had the best O last year and two turnstiles at tackle for stretches of last year.   

I'm not worried.  We have money, draft capital, and a very strong overall team.  Losing one player isn't going to break this team.   Overpaying for an avg dude very well might though.

[Lamardirts 2,114]

12 hours ago, kkuenn said:

Not guaranteed a 3rd in comp though. If we pick up a good amount of FAs ourselves it could mean a lesser comp pick. Who knows though as they have never said what the formula is for the process. 

Depends what type of FAs.  Cut guys don't count and those guys are typically 2nd-3rd contract guys who have already made their money and often times want to play for a winner.   We are in a good position this offseason.  

[jetlord 10,209]

1 hour ago, Lamardirts said:

    We have the ammo to move up and lock up a LT in the first, we can sign a one year vet or a couple looking for a ring and draft a LT at 31.  

Agree nearly 100% but there's one thing in your post and several others that I don't understand.  Many say the Chiefs can move up to get the LT they need.  Move up how far?  Moving in the first round is very expensive in terms of draft capital.  Unlike last year, the Chiefs extra picks are late day three with the exception of a second round four pick.  To move up much will require a day two pick.  Would you give up a potential future starter at Edge or WR to move up five or six spots?  Who would have to fall that far to make it worthwhile.  I'm not opposed to moving up to get the guy the staff wants, but just can't envision who that would be and how much would be given up.  

[mex 65,581]

9 minutes ago, jetlord said:

Agree nearly 100% but there's one thing in your post and several others that I don't understand.  Many say the Chiefs can move up to get the LT they need.  Move up how far?  Moving in the first round is very expensive in terms of draft capital.  Unlike last year, the Chiefs extra picks are late day three with the exception of a second round four pick.  To move up much will require a day two pick.  Would you give up a potential future starter at Edge or WR to move up five or six spots?  Who would have to fall that far to make it worthwhile.  I'm not opposed to moving up to get the guy the staff wants, but just can't envision who that would be and how much would be given up.  

I don't see anyone giving up a mid-teens selection for a #31 and a smattering of 5th, 6th and 7th round picks. 

It ain't worth giving up a 31 and 63 either... at least IMHO

[kkuenn 3,597]

3 hours ago, jetlord said:

Agree nearly 100% but there's one thing in your post and several others that I don't understand.  Many say the Chiefs can move up to get the LT they need.  Move up how far?  Moving in the first round is very expensive in terms of draft capital.  Unlike last year, the Chiefs extra picks are late day three with the exception of a second round four pick.  To move up much will require a day two pick.  Would you give up a potential future starter at Edge or WR to move up five or six spots?  Who would have to fall that far to make it worthwhile.  I'm not opposed to moving up to get the guy the staff wants, but just can't envision who that would be and how much would be given up.  

Veach has made all the other GMs his bitches. He will figure it out if one is available at the 20s or so.

[kkuenn 3,597]

 

[jetlord 10,209]

1 hour ago, kkuenn said:

Veach has made all the other GMs his bitches. He will figure it out if one alive to the 20s or so.

Back to my point, what will the Chiefs have to give up to move up to, say, #22?  It's easy to say it should happen, but harder to see the details.