Hopkins released

[arrowhead 1,070]

Just now, mex said:

not necessarily pushing for clark... if you were paying attention this season I was one of the few giving him hell

there are quite a few edge and interior DL guys still available... clark has a ton of rings... but there are others who don't, and might could work cheap.

Defense right now is top 10.

[Thegoatee 1,780]

Maybe Bill O’Brien wasn’t as stupid as everyone thought…

[mex 65,581]

56 minutes ago, arrowhead said:

Defense right now is top 10.

I want top 5. 

Offense right now is top 5.

[sith13 1,746]

13 hours ago, arrowhead said:

Defense right now is top 10.

Let's make it top 5, then top 1 so we can make up for any injuries and such.

[arrowhead 1,070]

Why the facepalm OT?

2022 Chiefs finished 8th against the run (yards allowed)

10th against the pass

2nd in sacks

 

A lot of you think the D is in shambles. Far from it.

[azchief21 5,278]

1 minute ago, arrowhead said:

Why the facepalm OT?

2022 Chiefs finished 8th against the run (yards allowed)

10th against the pass

2nd in sacks

 

A lot of you think the D is in shambles. Far from it.

OT is contractually obligated to use facepalms. 

[jetlord 10,207]

On 5/29/2023 at 4:08 PM, arrowhead said:

What do you think Clark will be asking for?

I'd think the numbers have to be similar. 

If it comes down to him or DHop, DHop every time.

It may be proven wrong, but I think DHop will get a lot more than Clark, at least for the next two years.  

[dhitter 1,424]

On 5/29/2023 at 12:09 PM, jetlord said:

Lots of teams are desperate to win.  Cincy is just as high on that list as the Bills.  Even teams that have won in the past are desperate to get back there.  The Bills, Chiefs, and any other team that think DHop will make them better contenders are in the running if the price is right.  I don't think the Bills are a team that needs another #1 receiver.  And the way Mahomes spreads the ball around, the Chiefs may not need a #1 at all as long as Kelce is playing at top level.  I'd like Hopkins to play for the Chiefs, but not at the cost of a future contract for one of the core players already here.  

Yeah ...the Browns, Jets, Raiders. Lots of teams are desperate to win. But how many teams have been as hyped as Buffalo and shown so little for it? I would put the Ravens in that mix for sure. Possibly the Chargers. I don't put Cincy on the list because they at least made it to a SB recently and probably believe they'll be back soon. But the Bills obviously made a deep push (like the Chiefs) to inquire about Hopkins. If they sign him not only do they get him but prevents someone else (like the Chiefs) from getting him. That's why I think he'll wind up in Buffalo. Just my take....not scientific fact.

[jetlord 10,207]

4 hours ago, dhitter said:

Yeah ...the Browns, Jets, Raiders. Lots of teams are desperate to win. But how many teams have been as hyped as Buffalo and shown so little for it? I would put the Ravens in that mix for sure. Possibly the Chargers. I don't put Cincy on the list because they at least made it to a SB recently and probably believe they'll be back soon. But the Bills obviously made a deep push (like the Chiefs) to inquire about Hopkins. If they sign him not only do they get him but prevents someone else (like the Chiefs) from getting him. That's why I think he'll wind up in Buffalo. Just my take....not scientific fact.

All good points, but would Hopkins make the Bills that much better?  They have good receivers already and not a ton of cap room.  Same with the Chiefs.  Without their #1 receiver, Hill, they led the league in offense and Mahomes passed for a gazillion yards with a league leading number of big plays.  I'm not saying a top receiver wouldn't make either team better.  I am saying that neither team should sign Hopkins at the cost of losing some other starter next season for the marginal improvement of SB chances.  If Hopkins is cheap and only wants a ring for his legacy, then sign him up.  If he wants that plus top receiver money, then pass. 

[dhitter 1,424]

7 hours ago, jetlord said:

All good points, but would Hopkins make the Bills that much better?  They have good receivers already and not a ton of cap room.  Same with the Chiefs.  Without their #1 receiver, Hill, they led the league in offense and Mahomes passed for a gazillion yards with a league leading number of big plays.  I'm not saying a top receiver wouldn't make either team better.  I am saying that neither team should sign Hopkins at the cost of losing some other starter next season for the marginal improvement of SB chances.  If Hopkins is cheap and only wants a ring for his legacy, then sign him up.  If he wants that plus top receiver money, then pass. 

I don't disagree with any of this. 

And I don't think Hopkins is necessarily looking for a big payday. I believe he is sincere in that he wants to go somewhere that gives him a chance to win a ring. But he also isn't going to settle for chump change. Someone will offer more than the Chiefs would for his services much in the same way the Ravens way overpaid for OBJ. The Chiefs are his "best" shot at a title but his agent will convince him that the Jets, Giants, Ravens....or some other team dangling a bigger wad of cash will afford him a chance at a ring.

I would love for Hopkins to come to the Chiefs. But as you have stated....there would be a cost to the development of the rest of the receiving corps.

[oldtimer 8,684]

Browns sure seem to think they have the inside line

[jetlord 10,207]

On 5/29/2023 at 6:24 PM, arrowhead said:

Defense right now is top 10.

In what way?  Last season the Chiefs were around 16th and 11th in points given up and yards allowed.

[Spfdchiefsfan 621]

2 hours ago, jetlord said:

In what way?  Last season the Chiefs were around 16th and 11th in points given up and yards allowed.

Technically they are unranked, they haven't played a game yet so................................................just sayn

[dhitter 1,424]

I think the best description I've heard of a Spags defense is that they are good "situationally". They do just enough to let Patrick and the offense have more opportunities to score. Anyone expecting the D to be a top 5 unit might be in for disappointment. But they will be good enough. This isn't like the Vermeil years 🙄

[KC Warpaint 3,234]

On 5/31/2023 at 7:38 AM, dhitter said:

I don't disagree with any of this. 

And I don't think Hopkins is necessarily looking for a big payday. I believe he is sincere in that he wants to go somewhere that gives him a chance to win a ring. But he also isn't going to settle for chump change. Someone will offer more than the Chiefs would for his services much in the same way the Ravens way overpaid for OBJ. The Chiefs are his "best" shot at a title but his agent will convince him that the Jets, Giants, Ravens....or some other team dangling a bigger wad of cash will afford him a chance at a ring.

I would love for Hopkins to come to the Chiefs. But as you have stated....there would be a cost to the development of the rest of the receiving corps.

Heard this morning that a lot of teams are interested in DHOP, this could become a bidding war real quick 

[KC Warpaint 3,234]

21 hours ago, oldtimer said:

Browns sure seem to think they have the inside line

Ravens seem to think that way as well

[jetlord 10,207]

5 hours ago, KC Warpaint said:

Ravens seem to think that way as well

Ravens just gave LJ8 a huge contract.  Then they gave OBJ a huge contract that will cost them for the next five years.  How can they afford a bidding war for DHop?  And, how well will OBJ and DHop share the #1 spotlight?  

[kccrow 529]

I totally get that D-Hop might be the win-now solution at WR but if I were Veach I wouldn't do it. 

You spent a 2nd on Moore, a 2nd on Rice, a 3rd on Toney who is a 1st-round guy, you're locked into MVS this year and he was fine, you have a super-talented guy in Justyn Ross that might surprise, John Ross is a former 1st rounder that really has been in the health issue boat more than the lack of talent boat, Richie James is a really solid slot, and you have a few guys that can battle it out for a STs slot including Watson who was at least a solid player for us. I mean, that's way more fucking talent than anyone in the media is giving KC credit for.

All you're doing by adding D-Hop is further log-jamming that WR room and you're probably going to force yourself to cut a guy that you might regret cutting. That might be the case as it stands.

Let the talent grow now and get the full use of their contract. 

[Holmes4six! 968]

6 minutes ago, kccrow said:

I totally get that D-Hop might be the win-now solution at WR but if I were Veach I wouldn't do it. 

You spent a 2nd on Moore, a 2nd on Rice, a 3rd on Toney who is a 1st-round guy, you're locked into MVS this year and he was fine, you have a super-talented guy in Justyn Ross that might surprise, John Ross is a former 1st rounder that really has been in the health issue boat more than the lack of talent boat, Richie James is a really solid slot, and you have a few guys that can battle it out for a STs slot including Watson who was at least a solid player for us. I mean, that's way more fucking talent than anyone in the media is giving KC credit for.

All you're doing by adding D-Hop is further log-jamming that WR room and you're probably going to force yourself to cut a guy that you might regret cutting. That might be the case as it stands.

Let the talent grow now and get the full use of their contract. 

Very well said. 
I do have a question and this is in no way promoting the addition of Dhop. 
who is our number 1 WR that will lineup on the outside? It has to be one of or both Rosses or watson. I would think. Sky, Toney and rice are slot guys. 
Next question. How will a defense play us vs with Dhop? 
currently I would bet they double kelce and man up everywhere else. 
If we add Dhop, it may not be that easy. He is not fast enough but has a reputation that may force a defense to shade him with a saftey. 
maybe we just trot out 3-TE sets and say fuck it! Try to stop us run and try to stop us pass out this formation. 
lol. 
looking forward to the feedback! 

[dhitter 1,424]

9 hours ago, KC Warpaint said:

Heard this morning that a lot of teams are interested in DHOP, this could become a bidding war real quick 

Yep. And by virtue of the fact he is supposedly talking to the Texans? Tells me all the "I want a ring" stuff is nothing more than lip service. He'll go wherever he gets the most green.

[mex 65,581]

10 hours ago, dhitter said:

I think the best description I've heard of a Spags defense is that they are good "situationally". They do just enough to let Patrick and the offense have more opportunities to score. Anyone expecting the D to be a top 5 unit might be in for disappointment. But they will be good enough. This isn't like the Vermeil years 🙄

which is why we don't need dhop... our offense is solid.

if we have money to spend it should be spent on defense.

[kccrow 529]

3 hours ago, Holmes4six! said:

Very well said. 
I do have a question and this is in no way promoting the addition of Dhop. 
who is our number 1 WR that will lineup on the outside? It has to be one of or both Rosses or watson. I would think. Sky, Toney and rice are slot guys. 
Next question. How will a defense play us vs with Dhop? 
currently I would bet they double kelce and man up everywhere else. 
If we add Dhop, it may not be that easy. He is not fast enough but has a reputation that may force a defense to shade him with a saftey. 
maybe we just trot out 3-TE sets and say fuck it! Try to stop us run and try to stop us pass out this formation. 
lol. 
looking forward to the feedback! 

Rice isn't a slot only guy by far but it might be his best usage. In fact, PFF charted him with 82.5% of his targets on the perimeter in 2022. A nice article here shows that he was top 10 in yards per target whether it was perimeter or slot alignments. I watched quite a bit of Rice, he was one of my top three favorite WR prospects in this draft. He can absolutely win at the X and Z. His quickness off the snap is going to be beneficial in either spot. His ability to find the zones is what might put him in the slot.

Reid focuses on guys that can be multiple in their alignments and I think he has alot of that right now. MVS can run the X or Z. Moore can run the Z/Slot and maybe even some X with his route running. Toney can run anywhere. Justyn Ross can run X or Z. Watson can run anywhere. James can run Z or Slot. John Ross can run Z/Slot for sure. I don't really think we're missing anything that much.

As for the WR1 mentality, I don't subscribe to any theory that it needs to be a specific alignment. Your slot might be your best WR. See Darnell Mooney the past couple years in Chicago. See the 37 different slow white guys with great hands and short area quickness the Pats trotted out for years. See Renfrow in LV for a few seasons. Hell, Kupp runs alot of slot. WR1 doesn't mean dominant X. Our top WR last year ran alot of Slot and Z alignments.

I would think Toney has the most ability to be a "WR1" if your mentality is "best WR." Honestly, Reid will probably play the guy at the Z that can run the most without getting winded. It doesn't need to be a guy that has A-B-C traits. He's going to put the guy that can best find the areas in zones in the slot, most likely. And then he'll run the guy at the X that can make man coverage pay. That's my best guess. If I were betting, I think we're going to see alot of Moore at the Z and Rice in the slot with MVS in the X and then Toney is going to rotate through them all. Of course, you're going to see 100 variations but that's my pick for your immediate alignments. I don't know what Reid will ultimately do but it's going to be a battle for the other 2 slots. It's going to get interesting. My picks right now would be Justyn Ross and Richie James will be the other two and then they'll stash a few on the PS, probably Watson and John Ross. I'm not going to sleep on Remigio though, I think he'll flash alot on STs and as a slot so they might develop him for next year to replace James. You still have some wildcards in Smith-Marsette, Fryfogle, and Ealy out there too. Yes, I'm leaving Powell off, he's a turd.

Anyhow, that's why I'm saying that if you sign D-Hop you might prematurely cut a sleeper prospect like Ross or you push a good special team's guy off the bottom like James and then we all cry about some facet or another. Let these kids grow, I think it'll surprise everyone. 

 

[KC Warpaint 3,234]

13 hours ago, jetlord said:

Ravens just gave LJ8 a huge contract.  Then they gave OBJ a huge contract that will cost them for the next five years.  How can they afford a bidding war for DHop?  And, how well will OBJ and DHop share the #1 spotlight?  

A lot of the media heads seem to think that Lamar will flip some sort of switch now that he has his contract and OBJ 

[DieHard 2,061]

I don’t think Dhop moves the needle enough to pay as much as some. He is better than ant WR on the roster, but we have a great group of potential 2s.

MVS, Sky, Rice, Toney are locks. 

Watson is guaranteed money to where they seem to plan on keeping him.

James has a skill set that will be hard to cut. 
John Ross has blazing speed and huge upside.

Justin Ross has great length and athleticism. 

I don’t see Dhop being enough bang for our buck. 

[arthur75 415]

12 minutes ago, KC Warpaint said:

A lot of the media heads seem to think that Lamar will flip some sort of switch now that he has his contract and OBJ 

I don't see it. I just do not think you win championships with a QB that runs better than he throws. It will win you alot of games but come playoff time you better have a damn good throwing QB. And in my opinion Lamar is not that guy. I would of let him walk in free agency. My hope is that all these media idiots that kept saying pay him pay him when the Raverns have buyers remorse that they come forward and say oops my bad.