What the Chiefs have to stop doing Salary Cap

[CranjisMcbasketball 780]

Here is a list of where we are spending Cap Dollars this season.

Mahomes $37,133,824

Chris Jones $26,808,355

Kelce $14,801,944

Thuney $13,405,32

Justin Reid $12,700,000

MVS  $11,000,000

Frank Clark $7,541,943

Jawaan Taylor $5,825,000

Butker $5,105,267

Omenihu $4,490,000

CEH $3,443,229

 

We absolutely HAVE TO get out of the habbit of allocated large portions of our cap to average players. See Justin Reid, MVS, Frank Clark, Jawaan Taylor.

 

We finally started getting out of the terrible contracts the likes of Frank Clark, Anthony Hitchens, Mathieu.. etc. AND WE JUMP RIGHT BACK IN with Jawaan Taylor and Justin Reid

Look Justin Reid is a fine player, but similar players are had in free agency every year for 3 mil, you simply can't pay them to be top 5 on the team. Jawaan Taylor has never thought to be a top Tackle in the league, yet veach gives him top of the market value.

Hell I love Thuney, and his cap number is high because they keep restructuring his deal to make space for other players, but as bad as our O line has been its crazy we have invested so much into it.

 

Now everyone is correct, the real problem is we have no WR talent on the roster, and Mahomes has no time to throw.

 

THIS IS BECAUSE we consistenly give out stupid contracts to average at best players and have no money left over to pay difference making WR's when they hit the market.

 

Clearly the chiefs strategy was "we can make any WR viable because mahomes is so good and we will build a dominant O Line." Problem is they clearly can't evaluate O line properly anymore to make that strategy work.

 

Bottom Line, if you have a no doubt elite player on the roster, pay them. See Mahomes, Kelce, Jones, Tyreek (Sneed is in this discussion now but that is a whole different topic)

Conversly. IF THE PLAYER IS NOT CLEARLY A DIFFERENCE MAKER, DO NOT PAY THEM TOP OF THE MARKET CAP SPACE. See Jawaan Taylor, Anthony Hitchens, MVS, Frank Clark, Justin Reid, Tyrann Matheiu.

If we aren't' sure a player is a difference maker, keep the flexibility on the salary cap to snag a deandre hopkins or similar type player when they come available so we aren't screwed.

 

 

[Thegoatee 1,780]

Unfortunately, the market will dictate price. Panicked GMs will help drive up prices of everyone. Rookies having to earn their second contract inflated the market for guys entering free agency.

Frank Clark was always a terrible deal relative to his regular season production. Honey Badger was okay but clearly started making business decisions instead of playing hard. Taylor is overpaid for being average and committing a lot of penalties. MVS is absolutely terrible and I have no clue what the heck they saw in a below average WR from Green Bay who dropped a lot of balls.

Dynasties always keep long term success by drafting well. Rarely is a free agent on a big deal a difference maker.

[CranjisMcbasketball 780]

16 minutes ago, Thegoatee said:

Unfortunately, the market will dictate price. Panicked GMs will help drive up prices of everyone. Rookies having to earn their second contract inflated the market for guys entering free agency.

Frank Clark was always a terrible deal relative to his regular season production. Honey Badger was okay but clearly started making business decisions instead of playing hard. Taylor is overpaid for being average and committing a lot of penalties. MVS is absolutely terrible and I have no clue what the heck they saw in a below average WR from Green Bay who dropped a lot of balls.

Dynasties always keep long term success by drafting well. Rarely is a free agent on a big deal a difference maker.

The point is our GM can’t be the one panicking and paying the driven up market price. Let the crap teams do that

[Okiechief1 425]

11 hours ago, Thegoatee said:

Unfortunately, the market will dictate price. Panicked GMs will help drive up prices of everyone. Rookies having to earn their second contract inflated the market for guys entering free agency.

Frank Clark was always a terrible deal relative to his regular season production. Honey Badger was okay but clearly started making business decisions instead of playing hard. Taylor is overpaid for being average and committing a lot of penalties. MVS is absolutely terrible and I have no clue what the heck they saw in a below average WR from Green Bay who dropped a lot of balls.

Dynasties always keep long term success by drafting well. Rarely is a free agent on a big deal a difference maker.

Are there really any long term dynasties? Even if you go back to pre salary cap it’s usually about 4 to 6 year run then it’s over.  Packers and Chiefs in the late 60s early 70s.  Steelers of the late 70s did 4 out 6. The Niners won early in the 80s then didn’t get back for another 6 or 7 years.  Cowboys of the early 90s was just 4 years.   Pats is the only one you could say was long term and KC isn’t going to equal that but even they had period of several years between the last one they won to the next one they won.  
 

sadly I think we are entering that period where it might be a few years before we get back to mountaintop.  Veach took calculated swings and missed.  It happens. 

[KC Warpaint 3,234]

12 hours ago, CranjisMcbasketball said:

The point is our GM can’t be the one panicking and paying the driven up market price. Let the crap teams do that

so you think that if a GM has to pay the going rate for a player at a needed position, then he is panicking. Fact is that the Chiefs will have to pay a bit more this offseason for the skill players because agents already know what the team needs and the question will be, How badly do you want a particular player. This team may need to make a play for a top tier talent this offseason either thru FA or a Trade and they will have to pay.

Potential FA Receivers:

https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/free-agents/all/wide-receiver/

 

 

 

[oldtimer 8,685]

25 minutes ago, KC Warpaint said:

so you think that if a GM has to pay the going rate for a player at a needed position, then he is panicking. Fact is that the Chiefs will have to pay a bit more this offseason for the skill players because agents already know what the team needs and the question will be, How badly do you want a particular player. This team may need to make a play for a top tier talent this offseason either thru FA or a Trade and they will have to pay.

Potential FA Receivers:

https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/free-agents/all/wide-receiver/

 

 

 

that's an underwhelming list. the Bucs have alrady said they are not resigning Evans but that shows a Market Value of 4 yr $94M/$23+M a year  for that kinda $$ I'd keep CJ, OBJ on the other hand at1 year $13M is not so bad but I just dont like the guy. . I'd sure like to see them take a stab at Kennan Allen or maybe a trade for a Tyler Lockett he's got 2 years at $15M left.

Even IF the Chiefs spent their top 2 picks on a WR it's a stretch to think they'd have any meaningful benefit  in their first year so maybe a high WR pick and a FA and Rice then see what happens after that, throw a TE in the Draft also?

[Okiechief1 425]

35 minutes ago, oldtimer said:

that's an underwhelming list. the Bucs have alrady said they are not resigning Evans but that shows a Market Value of 4 yr $94M/$23+M a year  for that kinda $$ I'd keep CJ, OBJ on the other hand at1 year $13M is not so bad but I just dont like the guy. . I'd sure like to see them take a stab at Kennan Allen or maybe a trade for a Tyler Lockett he's got 2 years at $15M left.

Even IF the Chiefs spent their top 2 picks on a WR it's a stretch to think they'd have any meaningful benefit  in their first year so maybe a high WR pick and a FA and Rice then see what happens after that, throw a TE in the Draft also?

Higgins from Cincy is another one to look at with a market value of 22.6.  I like Allen but the guy seems to be injured for a few games a year.  Eckler from the Chargers I would be really interested in. Solid runner and receiving threat out of the backfield.   Also have the LT spot to figure out.  To get one that can come in and play right away you’re probably looking at getting into the top 15 which is going to take draft capital or pay in FA.   Right now there is more problems than solutions.  

[oldtimer 8,685]

46 minutes ago, Okiechief1 said:

Higgins from Cincy is another one to look at with a market value of 22.6.  I like Allen but the guy seems to be injured for a few games a year.  Eckler from the Chargers I would be really interested in. Solid runner and receiving threat out of the backfield.   Also have the LT spot to figure out.  To get one that can come in and play right away you’re probably looking at getting into the top 15 which is going to take draft capital or pay in FA.   Right now there is more problems than solutions.  

The kid playing LT now with a Training Camp under his belt  to me is worth the gamble with only 6 picks and maybe 2 more compensatory picks worth a hoot  ( for CJ and Sneed) we dont have the draft capital to move up IMO

[kkuenn 3,597]

3 hours ago, KC Warpaint said:

so you think that if a GM has to pay the going rate for a player at a needed position, then he is panicking. Fact is that the Chiefs will have to pay a bit more this offseason for the skill players because agents already know what the team needs and the question will be, How badly do you want a particular player. This team may need to make a play for a top tier talent this offseason either thru FA or a Trade and they will have to pay.

Potential FA Receivers:

https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/free-agents/all/wide-receiver/

 

 

 

We need to get those 1 year type guys that fill the whole while we draft. Get a true good guy when we can for multiple years. Dont over pay for older vets on long contracts. Why I think Jomes will be gone and we use that money to retain our own and go into Fa with money to spend Would be nice for players like Schuster who comes in for a year and wants a ring, while playing for less for a chance to win it all.

Thought Hopkins would be that type for us this year but maybe the Bucs WR Evans willl do that. Then again he already has a ring and may just want the money. I still think Ridley will be the right choice. If not him then Higgins.

[oldtimer 8,685]

JMO but that "playing for a Ring" thought  worked for the Pats but not sure that ship really ever launched for the Chiefs..not sure why but now that ship is taking on water. IF I where an older player in that situation.. 49rs, Eagles, Bungholes, Browns, Bills maybe even Miami would be just as much on my radar

[reesebobby 5,661]

The Jawaan contract is a problem.  I don't see how they can pay him what is owed next year, and he has a pretty nasty dead cap hit also.  MVS is gone next year I'd think.  Those 2 and Clark stand out, but I don't understand why we'd have the Mahomes, Kelce and Jones contracts listed in the thread about what we need to quit doing.  Even Thuney, Butker and Omenihu don't really fit into that.  CEH hasn't been good, but 3 million isn't really a problem contract either.  

[CranjisMcbasketball 780]

2 minutes ago, reesebobby said:

The Jawaan contract is a problem.  I don't see how they can pay him what is owed next year, and he has a pretty nasty dead cap hit also.  MVS is gone next year I'd think.  Those 2 and Clark stand out, but I don't understand why we'd have the Mahomes, Kelce and Jones contracts listed in the thread about what we need to quit doing.  Even Thuney, Butker and Omenihu don't really fit into that.  CEH hasn't been good, but 3 million isn't really a problem contract either.  

I just listed the top 10 cap hits on the team.

and underneath that is why i wrote pay the elite guys whatever they want and stop paying the average guys as if they are elite.

its a no brainer statement, but one that is rarely followed in the nfl.

then every year the statement “thats just the going rate” in free agency is stated. The fact is there is nothing forcing these GMs to pay average players the “going rate”

[oldtimer 8,685]

13 minutes ago, CranjisMcbasketball said:

I just listed the top 10 cap hits on the team.

and underneath that is why i wrote pay the elite guys whatever they want and stop paying the average guys as if they are elite.

its a no brainer statement, but one that is rarely followed in the nfl.

then every year the statement “thats just the going rate” in free agency is stated. The fact is there is nothing forcing these GMs to pay average players the “going rate”

that's called "Collusion" IF it can be proved not to mention you become THAT TEAM nobody wants to play for

[CranjisMcbasketball 780]

4 hours ago, oldtimer said:

that's called "Collusion" IF it can be proved not to mention you become THAT TEAM nobody wants to play for

I apologize, I guess im not making this clear.

all im saying is no one held a gun to veaches head making him pay jawaan Taylor 20 mil a year .

its not collusion to offer a player of jawaan Taylors skill 8 mil a year and if he says no then you move on to a different option.

people wont be so understanding when Chris Jones walks this offseason because Taylor is being payed instead 

[mex 65,581]

7 hours ago, reesebobby said:

The Jawaan contract is a problem.  I don't see how they can pay him what is owed next year, and he has a pretty nasty dead cap hit also.  MVS is gone next year I'd think.  Those 2 and Clark stand out, but I don't understand why we'd have the Mahomes, Kelce and Jones contracts listed in the thread about what we need to quit doing.  Even Thuney, Butker and Omenihu don't really fit into that.  CEH hasn't been good, but 3 million isn't really a problem contract either.  

CEH has been damned good for 3 mil. Hell of a lot better than MVS who's damned near 4 times the cost.

[kkuenn 3,597]

3 hours ago, CranjisMcbasketball said:

I apologize, I guess im not making this clear.

all im saying is no one held a gun to veaches head making him pay jawaan Taylor 20 mil a year .

its not collusion to offer a player of jawaan Taylors skill 8 mil a year and if he says no then you move on to a different option.

people wont be so understanding when Chris Jones walks this offseason because Taylor is being payed instead 

Lol, Taylor won't be the reason Jones moves on. I mean the need of retaining 4 if our own players or using it for FA WR etc need will be the reason

 That and he will be 31 then?

[CranjisMcbasketball 780]

36 minutes ago, kkuenn said:

Lol, Taylor won't be the reason Jones moves on. I mean the need of retaining 4 if our own players or using it for FA WR etc need will be the reason

 That and he will be 31 then?

Taylors cap hit is 25 million next season. If we cut him its a 34 million dollar cap hit.

sure sounds a lot like the kind of contract chris jones will end up getting to me.

im really not understanding why anyone here is defending taylor. Our rookie at LT who is making less than a million is playing significantly better, thats my point. If the player isn’t elite fill the need cheaply in the draft or bargain free agency. 

[Lamardirts 2,114]

10 hours ago, reesebobby said:

The Jawaan contract is a problem.  I don't see how they can pay him what is owed next year, and he has a pretty nasty dead cap hit also.  MVS is gone next year I'd think.  Those 2 and Clark stand out, but I don't understand why we'd have the Mahomes, Kelce and Jones contracts listed in the thread about what we need to quit doing.  Even Thuney, Butker and Omenihu don't really fit into that.  CEH hasn't been good, but 3 million isn't really a problem contract either.  

I still think Taylor could at least improve and play at an above avg level.  Probably never going to earn that paycheck but I don't think he is necessarily a sunk cost.   I also think the lack of options and a miscalculation on the FA tackle market probably caused Veach to overpay to get him in and seal up an important need on the OL.  Gonna miss sometimes.    How long are we locked into him.  Can't we get out after next year or is the 3rd year dead cap hit brutal as well.

 

[CranjisMcbasketball 780]

1 hour ago, Lamardirts said:

I still think Taylor could at least improve and play at an above avg level.  Probably never going to earn that paycheck but I don't think he is necessarily a sunk cost.   I also think the lack of options and a miscalculation on the FA tackle market probably caused Veach to overpay to get him in and seal up an important need on the OL.  Gonna miss sometimes.    How long are we locked into him.  Can't we get out after next year or is the 3rd year dead cap hit brutal as well.

 

His dead cap after next season is 9.5 mil. thats a no brainer he won't be here after next season.

 

[oldtimer 8,685]

11 hours ago, CranjisMcbasketball said:

Taylors cap hit is 25 million next season. If we cut him its a 34 million dollar cap hit.

sure sounds a lot like the kind of contract chris jones will end up getting to me.

im really not understanding why anyone here is defending taylor. Our rookie at LT who is making less than a million is playing significantly better, thats my point. If the player isn’t elite fill the need cheaply in the draft or bargain free agency. 

Taylor was a gamble that failed......the end. It happens  water under the bridge. I'm certainly not blaming the Taylor contract on CJ leaving. It's part of it but so is CJ/Agent & Veach. After this year CJ may just want to grab his payday and move on.

No one is defending Taylor but what would you do about him?  Your views are simplistic while providing no realistic answers. You want to either gamble on a rookie or throw  MORE $$$  at another FA

[Spfdchiefsfan 621]

I'm curious where Taylor ranks in tackles.  I mean I know he has had some offisdes, but he seems to be doing a lot better there, and I don't see him called much for other things.  I'll be honest, I'm not sure a lot of his calls aren't because effing Chris Collinsworth made such a big deal of it.  I'm sure some are warranted, no one is perfect.  I'm not saying he's great, but, he is a hell of a lot better than Wylie, and that lazy bozo on the left side before he got hurt.

[Holmes4six! 968]

2 hours ago, Spfdchiefsfan said:

I'm curious where Taylor ranks in tackles.  I mean I know he has had some offisdes, but he seems to be doing a lot better there, and I don't see him called much for other things.  I'll be honest, I'm not sure a lot of his calls aren't because effing Chris Collinsworth made such a big deal of it.  I'm sure some are warranted, no one is perfect.  I'm not saying he's great, but, he is a hell of a lot better than Wylie, and that lazy bozo on the left side before he got hurt.

I’m not sure where he is ranked or how they rank them. Sacks given up, pressures, penalties or all above. 

[CranjisMcbasketball 780]

4 hours ago, oldtimer said:

Taylor was a gamble that failed......the end. It happens  water under the bridge. I'm certainly not blaming the Taylor contract on CJ leaving. It's part of it but so is CJ/Agent & Veach. After this year CJ may just want to grab his payday and move on.

No one is defending Taylor but what would you do about him?  Your views are simplistic while providing no realistic answers. You want to either gamble on a rookie or throw  MORE $$$  at another FA

I am just stating this as more of something us fans should be aware of. To stop going bananas in free agency for marginal talent. Its not specific to Taylor.

for instance if veach goes out this offseason and gives WR Tyler Boyd a 4 year 16 mil a year deal when he is more like a 6 mil a year type player, our eye brows should raise.

 This is all im saying, it has to stop at some point