KCSLC2008 606 Posted May 21, 2015 Share Posted May 21, 2015 Say it wit me S L O W L Y........West. TOGETHER NOW MANNING HAS BEATEN US 19 OF 20 TIMES. TO BE A CONTENDER WE HAVE TO BEAT MANNING. RIGHT NOW MANNING MEANS TWO LOSSES A YEAR FOR US. DOES ANYONE ON THIS BOARD WHAT WE GOTO D O TO IMPROVE? ITS SIMPLEM. BEAT MANNING. BEAT MANNING. BEAT MANNING. UNTIL WE DO we wre just pretenders. Wilkie, Dude, have a snickers bar, you are typing like Roseanne Barr.... Its about the Chiefs and "their window" not the Bronco's and their window. If the Chiefs beat Manning 2x and still lose to the Raiders 2x your point is moot. w We beat Brady and Seattle last year, losing against Oakland and Tennessee, and while I don't want to exaggerate the wins, I'm a bit tired of those who dismiss them and put emphasis on ur losses. We beat them straight up and our bad days against Titans/Raiders weren't any less flukish than the Patriots/Seahawks (just the point difference was flukish for Pats, not the result). We were good enough to beat them barely and they f'ed up. Brady > Manning in many respects, we just play Manning more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kychief 239 Posted May 22, 2015 Share Posted May 22, 2015 Say it wit me S L O W L Y........West. TOGETHER NOW MANNING HAS BEATEN US 19 OF 20 TIMES. TO BE A CONTENDER WE HAVE TO BEAT MANNING. RIGHT NOW MANNING MEANS TWO LOSSES A YEAR FOR US. DOES ANYONE ON THIS BOARD WHAT WE GOTO D O TO IMPROVE? ITS SIMPLEM. BEAT MANNING. BEAT MANNING. BEAT MANNING. UNTIL WE DO we wre just pretenders. yep I agree... it all goes though that big headed bastard... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kychief 239 Posted May 22, 2015 Share Posted May 22, 2015 and wilkie.. your CAPS use needs some work...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eraser 722 Posted May 22, 2015 Share Posted May 22, 2015 The windows don't always close as soon as people think. The Chiefs are doing some good things. They are building some solid depth. The team is stronger than it has been in a long time. Last year was tough. I thought they did better than I expected, and I did not anticipate all the injuries. Can the Chiefs beat Denver? Yes. Is it an advantage to play them at home the second game of the year? No. The Chiefs should be better, later in the season as players start to get acclimated to the team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mugsy 225 Posted May 22, 2015 Share Posted May 22, 2015 One more reason it will happen this year.... WE ARE DUE.... 19 of 20 is ridiculous. It's going to stop soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wilkie 1,518 Posted May 22, 2015 Share Posted May 22, 2015 We are Not due shit Mugsy. We have to dethrone Manning and still hold off an improving oakland. Iit up tous but it isnt our destiny. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wilkie 1,518 Posted May 22, 2015 Share Posted May 22, 2015 Damn spell check posting on a tablet Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SEMO 6,811 Posted May 22, 2015 Share Posted May 22, 2015 For all of our benefit, please turn off spellcheck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dhitter 1,424 Posted May 22, 2015 Author Share Posted May 22, 2015 Can KC beat Denver?....no doubt in my mind. Doesn't mean they will. In the Super Bowl win, Seattle absolutely threw Denver off it's game because they created pressure and they used their team speed to keep the receivers from any YAC. Manning completed a ton of underneath stuff but there was always a guy there to "pop" the receiver when he caught it. You could see it was creating a level of frustration that got into their heads. Manning won't be bombing the daylights out of us but he can still create a lot of damage with those underneath routes (especially the crossing routes) unless we are ready for it. I'm looking at those first two games of the season. At the Texans and then home at the Broncos. If somehow we can win those first two games I can pretty much guarantee the Chiefs will make the playoffs. Lose the first two? That would be tough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wilkie 1,518 Posted May 22, 2015 Share Posted May 22, 2015 Crossing routes have killed us sine Dale Carter was traded. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dhitter 1,424 Posted May 24, 2015 Author Share Posted May 24, 2015 We are heavily invested in the db's. I'm hoping that bodes well for us regarding things like bubble screens and crossing routes. We will see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieHard 2,061 Posted May 25, 2015 Share Posted May 25, 2015 Big pressure on Alex this year. He's got new toys with speed to burn. If he doesn't get the ball to them, the passing ineptitude falls squarely on him. If he can produce, KC will be an elite team with 12+ wins. If not, we'll be on the bubble and will need to get a new QB in 2016. What I worry about is that teams blanket Mac and get pressure on Alex. We don't know about the line and we didn't really add weapons. More that we exchanged Bowe for Mac. Still need that #2 guy to emerge. Don't know who it is, but if Mac pulls a hammy and sits for 3 weeks, it will be hard to move the ball. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KCSLC2008 606 Posted May 25, 2015 Share Posted May 25, 2015 What I worry about is that teams blanket Mac and get pressure on Alex. We don't know about the line and we didn't really add weapons. More that we exchanged Bowe for Mac. Still need that #2 guy to emerge. Don't know who it is, but if Mac pulls a hammy and sits for 3 weeks, it will be hard to move the ball. Here's hoping for Maclin's health, Alex's for that matter. If they stay healthy, I think defenses will respect Maclin more than Bowe because Smith will trust Maclin more. The players behind Maclin will be more experienced than last year and hopefully more reliable than Avery. I see it clicking if they remain healthy and the oline protects a bit better, get that 45 sacks down to 30 even and no laceration, that would be 15 potentially key plays in 1-2 more wins in games we barely lost last year. 3-4 games would need a big jump, not expecting it, but I'd be the least surprised on this board. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dhitter 1,424 Posted May 26, 2015 Author Share Posted May 26, 2015 Here's hoping for Maclin's health, Alex's for that matter. If they stay healthy, I think defenses will respect Maclin more than Bowe because Smith will trust Maclin more. The players behind Maclin will be more experienced than last year and hopefully more reliable than Avery. I see it clicking if they remain healthy and the oline protects a bit better, get that 45 sacks down to 30 even and no laceration, that would be 15 potentially key plays in 1-2 more wins in games we barely lost last year. 3-4 games would need a big jump, not expecting it, but I'd be the least surprised on this board. Smith will trust Maclin more? Really a projection and a hope as opposed to fact. We don't know that Smith will trust Maclin more. Smith is a hard one to figure out isn't he? He can throw deep but doesn't do it very often. We often blame the line and lack of time to set up the deep ball...but truthfully, based on the small sample size I've seen, Smith doesn't throw a very good deep ball. Has trouble leading the receiver. Several times he over threw his man and the one big play to Albert Wilson was under thrown otherwise it would have been a TD. The only long bomb I can remember that looked like an NFL QB threw it was the bomb to Avery in the playoff game and there wasn't a defender within 15 yards of him so how hard could it have been? Not saying Smith and Maclin can't do some great things....but it's hardly a lock. Basically, Smith is a 3,300-3,600 yard kind of guy. Even if our Oline is upgraded and the WR position as well... He is still going to be about a 220 yards a game QB. it's just the yards are distributed differently. My opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KCSLC2008 606 Posted May 26, 2015 Share Posted May 26, 2015 Smith will trust Maclin more? Really a projection and a hope as opposed to fact. We don't know that Smith will trust Maclin more. Smith is a hard one to figure out isn't he? He can throw deep but doesn't do it very often. We often blame the line and lack of time to set up the deep ball...but truthfully, based on the small sample size I've seen, Smith doesn't throw a very good deep ball. Has trouble leading the receiver. Several times he over threw his man and the one big play to Albert Wilson was under thrown otherwise it would have been a TD. The only long bomb I can remember that looked like an NFL QB threw it was the bomb to Avery in the playoff game and there wasn't a defender within 15 yards of him so how hard could it have been? Not saying Smith and Maclin can't do some great things....but it's hardly a lock. Basically, Smith is a 3,300-3,600 yard kind of guy. Even if our Oline is upgraded and the WR position as well... He is still going to be about a 220 yards a game QB. it's just the yards are distributed differently. My opinion.I know this is nit picky, but Smith's 16 game output the last two years would have been 3534 and 3482 respectively, so I feel his range to be expected with a better oline (cerca 2013) is 3534 and adding better receivers, that number should jump, too. So my guess is 3600-4000, with the 4K not being that realistic. All it takes is for the 7.0 YPA to go to 7.5, when his career high is 8.0. The trust with Bowe was so low it wasn't exactly setting a high standard. I think the guys behind Maclin are better but we're all guessing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gil 243 Posted May 26, 2015 Share Posted May 26, 2015 Here's hoping for Maclin's health, Alex's for that matter. If they stay healthy, I think defenses will respect Maclin more than Bowe because Smith will trust Maclin more. The players behind Maclin will be more experienced than last year and hopefully more reliable than Avery. I see it clicking if they remain healthy and the oline protects a bit better, get that 45 sacks down to 30 even and no laceration, that would be 15 potentially key plays in 1-2 more wins in games we barely lost last year. 3-4 games would need a big jump, not expecting it, but I'd be the least surprised on this board. The trust thing only goes so far in my book. It's much better to throw it to a guy you don't "trust" than to take a sack or check down to the 5-yd route on 3rd and 10. Our receivers and oline let us down for sure, but Alex gets plenty of blame too. I'll be watching Bowe's numbers this year with Cleveland's pathetic QBs. If he's better than last year with that lot, we need a new QB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eraser 722 Posted May 26, 2015 Share Posted May 26, 2015 Maclin improves this team because he is good at catching the ball. He was last in drop percentage in the league. That is a huge improvement over Bowe. His attitude is infectious. That should help with the development of the Chiefs' younger talent. I hope Wilson, and Conley learn from him. The Broncos have a problem on their offensive line. I expect the Chiefs to exploit their weaknesses. Manning has had an exceptional career, but he may not finish his final season. Osweiller probably will have to fill in for him this season. He is nearing the end of a long successful run. However, he is on the down side of his career, and the protection is worse than before. Poe and Houston should have a feast against Denver. History does not always predict the future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eraser 722 Posted May 26, 2015 Share Posted May 26, 2015 Maclin improves this team because he is good at catching the ball. He was last in drop percentage in the league. That is a huge improvement over Bowe. His attitude is infectious. That should help with the development of the Chiefs' younger talent. I hope Wilson, and Conley learn from him. The Broncos have a problem on their offensive line. I expect the Chiefs to exploit their weaknesses. Manning has had an exceptional career, but he may not finish his final season. Osweiller probably will have to fill in for him this season. He is nearing the end of a long successful run. However, he is on the down side of his career, and the protection is worse than before. Poe and Houston should have a feast against Denver. History does not always predict the future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KCSLC2008 606 Posted May 26, 2015 Share Posted May 26, 2015 The trust thing only goes so far in my book. It's much better to throw it to a guy you don't "trust" than to take a sack or check down to the 5-yd route on 3rd and 10. Our receivers and oline let us down for sure, but Alex gets plenty of blame too. I'll be watching Bowe's numbers this year with Cleveland's pathetic QBs. If he's better than last year with that lot, we need a new QB. In order for that to mean anything, you have to hold those QBs to the same standards for other pass catchers, effect on wins/losses, take into account the system, garbage time, etc. and if Bowe doesn't deliver, respond in kind to Smith without the reasons ("excuses" if for Smith) for non-production. Else, it means nothing if pathetic QBs force passes to Bowe, getting INTs to go with those yards and ignore others who are open or could get the first down (but instead getting an incompletion or INT). Pathetic QBs are pathetic QBs, it means little to me if those pathetic QBs choose to focus on one player or aspect and fail on others that may individually or in the aggregate be more important. Individual stats to one receiver is only one aspect of an overall effectiveness. You don't ignore Calvin Johnson, but you don't force it to Bowe. You shouldn't ignore Bowe, but don't act like it's the same as ignoring someone better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gil 243 Posted May 27, 2015 Share Posted May 27, 2015 In order for that to mean anything, you have to hold those QBs to the same standards for other pass catchers, effect on wins/losses, take into account the system, garbage time, etc. and if Bowe doesn't deliver, respond in kind to Smith without the reasons ("excuses" if for Smith) for non-production. Else, it means nothing if pathetic QBs force passes to Bowe, getting INTs to go with those yards and ignore others who are open or could get the first down (but instead getting an incompletion or INT). Pathetic QBs are pathetic QBs, it means little to me if those pathetic QBs choose to focus on one player or aspect and fail on others that may individually or in the aggregate be more important. Individual stats to one receiver is only one aspect of an overall effectiveness. You don't ignore Calvin Johnson, but you don't force it to Bowe. You shouldn't ignore Bowe, but don't act like it's the same as ignoring someone better. Not the point at all. If a qb doesn't convert 1st downs or misses out on big plays because he's afraid of turnovers, he's failing his team. We've all seen the tape of receivers (including Bowe) running free and Alex not getting the ball to them. I keep hearing trust as a "reason" for Bowe's lack of production and that's not acceptable because Smith didn't throw to any wideouts. Not to mention the many times Kelce was running wide open and didn't get the ball delivered to him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KCSLC2008 606 Posted May 28, 2015 Share Posted May 28, 2015 Not the point at all. If a qb doesn't convert 1st downs or misses out on big plays because he's afraid of turnovers, he's failing his team. We've all seen the tape of receivers (including Bowe) running free and Alex not getting the ball to them. I keep hearing trust as a "reason" for Bowe's lack of production and that's not acceptable because Smith didn't throw to any wideouts. Not to mention the many times Kelce was running wide open and didn't get the ball delivered to him. That makes more sense, but you didn't say that. I have heard people cite Bowe's stats with Cassel in one year and made it out to be sufficient reason for Cassel being better. You have to take more than that, realize Bowe's had down years elsewhere, there are positives to Smith in those first down stats, and negatives that go beyond Smith's negatives with Cassel. I think we're going to see fewer missed plays this year and that's where trust in the oline is going to slow his progressions a bit. Not talking drastic and not saying Smith can't prove to be the wrong guy (I get it some think he already is; opinion) - I'm just saying Bowe getting numbers won't prove it for me. There are play calls, game situations, successes that didn't call for pressing, etc. I will admit that you can go to the extreme and he has done so; it would be an overstatement to say he always does or that it always costs us or that we can't win real games with his style, considering he has stepped up before (Saints 2011 and Colts wasn't lost by avoiding wideout; it was lost by stepping out of bounds when Bowe said he could have gotten in). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KCSLC2008 606 Posted May 28, 2015 Share Posted May 28, 2015 I don't think he's afraid of turnovers, being smart with the ball has its limits, but it has its merits. He has the capability and it works out most of the time if you include all situations and not just when the defense folds and turns to him (San Diego, first 2013). He's recognized the situation before and went for it, in the playoffs, too. Putting your team in position and succeeding in most cannot be replaced by the alternative risk, even if missed on some, when he has responded before. It's not that simple; all QBs have lost before and you can't just single out one area. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dhitter 1,424 Posted May 28, 2015 Author Share Posted May 28, 2015 Poor Peyton Manning...he only threw for 4,700 yards and 39 TD's last year and had a QB rating higher than 100. Yep...he is sliding into the abyss due to old age and his injuries are catching up to him. Oh and he gets sacked on average... one time per game. Big Whoop! I refuse to predict the demise of Peyton Manning. People have been doing it for years. Denver will do whatever it needs to protect their HOF QB...even cheating if necessary. I expect a down (I'm pushing 40) type of season for Manning to be something like 4,300 yards and 35 TD's. Sad really. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kychief 239 Posted May 30, 2015 Share Posted May 30, 2015 Poor Peyton Manning...he only threw for 4,700 yards and 39 TD's last year and had a QB rating higher than 100. Yep...he is sliding into the abyss due to old age and his injuries are catching up to him. Oh and he gets sacked on average... one time per game. Big Whoop! I refuse to predict the demise of Peyton Manning. People have been doing it for years. Denver will do whatever it needs to protect their HOF QB...even cheating if necessary. I expect a down (I'm pushing 40) type of season for Manning to be something like 4,300 yards and 35 TD's. Sad really. yea hes a sack of shit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhataLerror 370 Posted May 30, 2015 Share Posted May 30, 2015 Not the point at all. If a qb doesn't convert 1st downs or misses out on big plays because he's afraid of turnovers, he's failing his team. We've all seen the tape of receivers (including Bowe) running free and Alex not getting the ball to them. I keep hearing trust as a "reason" for Bowe's lack of production and that's not acceptable because Smith didn't throw to any wideouts. Not to mention the many times Kelce was running wide open and didn't get the ball delivered to him. Meh, this is so wrong, and it gets old. Of the Chiefs' pass attempts in 2014, 95 passes were caught by runningbacks (if De'Anthony Thomas is counted as a runningback), 95 passes were caught by tight ends, and 129 were caught by wide receivers. In an offense that called for not a few designed runningback screens, it just seems like people get hung up on stereotypes rather than actually comparing what they've seen to what they've heard. Did players catch passes and get first downs? Smith ranked 14th in the league in receptions completed for first downs by rate, ahead of Philip Rivers, Matt Ryan, Eli Manning, Russell Wilson, Joe Flacco, Matthew Stafford, and some guy named Colin Kaepernick who is supposed to be one of the most explosive players in the league. I know you watched the games, but what happened between the game and the post that you didn't write what you saw? Quarterbacks miss receivers. It happens every game. I've never seen anyone show evidence that Smith misses open receivers at a much greater rate than that of the quarterbacks that are considered among the best. Get separation, and you get to catch passes. It's not a stretch for the quarterback to ask for that. Instead, Smith was tasked with finding a spot he could plant from without getting de-cleated, find a receiver that was in a position to receive a pass physically possible to throw (with trajectory and velocity presenting certain physical limitations in Smith's options), and manage to throw that pass through a lane where the pass wasn't likely to get batted down at the line of scrimmage. The Chiefs didn't cut Smith and keep Bowe, but rather they gave Bowe's job to Maclin. And honestly, I don't care what Bowe does in Cleveland because I already expect Bowe's stats to spike temporarily while a harem of quarterbacks with no future in the league throw him jump balls, a tactic known to get you 2-14 seasons and early draft picks that might become that next franchise quarterback. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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