Eric Fisher

[wilkie 1,518]

My argument Bil is to say that a player who goes back early is not as effective to the team dynamic.  He might want to give 100% but his work is affected by his injury whether he likes it or not.  Better IMHOP to give it more time and more rest.   The fans want Eric Fisher to start this Friday.  I don't think this should be rushed.

[Bilyous2 884]

My argument Bil is to say that a player who goes back early is not as effective to the team dynamic.  He might want to give 100% but his work is affected by his injury whether he likes it or not.  Better IMHOP to give it more time and more rest.   The fans want Eric Fisher to start this Friday.  I don't think this should be rushed.

I agree with you. Its pretty much what I was trying to say.  That very scenario is why the player should sign a release from liability if he wants to play. The team should also sign this.  This should happen coming back from any physicial injury to a joint or to the head. It should not be based only on a team physician's "clearing" a player based on strength exercises or on imaging. Physicians are not God nor should they be the final arbiter.  Their input is crucial but should not be final.  Symptoms should be final, not physical exam.

[KCSLC2008 606]

I agree with you. Its pretty much what I was trying to say. That very scenario is why the player should sign a release from liability if he wants to play. The team should also sign this. This should happen coming back from any physicial injury to a joint or to the head. It should not be based only on a team physician's "clearing" a player based on strength exercises or on imaging. Physicians are not God nor should they be the final arbiter. Their input is crucial but should not be final. Symptoms should be final, not physical exam.

Oh, this would be so difficult to execute. Locker room sauce already called players cowards when they don't play. For example, when Smith took himself out from the Niners when he had a grade three shoulder injury on his throwing arm that required surgery, the coach, Mike Nolan, told the players he was making excuses for his play and the locker room knew him as "the lion."

 

All we would get from this is the team shedding liability from that waiver when the player is pressured to play to not be a coward. Or they would use his desire to play and always not clear him, any player, to avoid liability later. They know that desire to play is strong. They would only be pressured to clear him regardless if he were a star who was OK with not playing but did not want to sign a waiver. But how often are you going to get that? You would just never clear a player and have them all sign a waiver to play.

 

I know you were trying to create an instance where rushing them to the field would create liability on the other end of the football career because the player, theoretically, would not sign a waiver to play if you wasn't ready. But you still have those situations where a player will play to avoid me a coward and to avoid having someone take his job. Now this waiver would be removing liability from the team. It's almost unconscionable to give the players choice. In exchange for not being covered liability wise, you get to play against your interests.

 

Until you address the likelihood of losing your job if you don't play or losing a roster spot or contract if you don't play, there's not going to be a solution. And even then, locker room culture prevents it.

[KCSLC2008 606]

For anyone who cares, here are the quotes from how he felt:

 

http://blogs.mercurynews.com/kawakami/2007/12/11/alex-smith-mike-nolan-feud-goes-thermo-nuclear-will-there-be-any-survivors/

 

"The set-up: The 49ers last night announced what we all already knew–Smith will undergo shoulder surgery and is out for the season.

 

But here’s what Smith told Georgatos yesterday, before the announcement:

 

–Smith said he feels that Nolan has undermined him to his teammates and that Nolan has been spinning his own side of the story about Smith’s struggles to comeback from the shoulder separation.

 

It sure sounds like Nolan might’ve purposely tried to cut off Smith from his teammates by implicitly or explicitly saying that Smith is too soft to play through pain. Which is bad, no matter what player is in the focus.

 

Here’s what Smith said: “That was my biggest concern when he did that: I felt it was trying to undermine me with my teammates.”

 

Wow. And more from the Georgatos interview:

 

“I think if (my teammates) would have heard what I actually said out there that day, it wouldn’t have been an issue,” Smith said of the day a few weeks ago when he suggested that Nolan had botched the handling of Smith’s comeback.

 

“But all of a sudden Nolan spins it as I was making excuses for an injury. What I really felt like was, ‘Yeah, I tried to play on it. And that was my decision and obviously I wasn’t playing well enough.”

[KCSLC2008 606]

And this was AFTER Smith playing on that grade three throwing shoulder injury for four games after the injury. Four games. Though I would admit that those four games probably made it a bit worse than the primary injury. The point is that he was playing through it and that is tough. Especially for quarterback on his throwing shoulder, and they were not a handoff to the runningback team back then.

 

What he said to Nolan reportedly was that he wasn't helping the team playing with his injury. He said he wasn't playing well enough regardless of the reasons. He couldn't pass the ball anywhere near the norm for him - this is what gave him his arm issues, as a throwing coach said his mechanics and strength was good before it and compensation ruined it before fixing it. By opening up this time, he got called a coward. By being honest about it after his concussion, he got his job taken.

 

This waiver doesn't save him from liability of his job or reputation - it only saves the team years later.

[KCSLC2008 606]

You posted above at 3:09 A.M?? Man gets some sleep!

That's what happens when you have a new puppy who keeps barking at night and your choice is to let her go bathroom in the house or take her out to go. I know they can be trained either way (just letting them poop where they sleep until they learn), I'd rather save the cleaning and trust you will eventually learn to sleep through the night. I also take her for a walk before we go to sleep. Plus, I'm not Central Time.

[Bilyous2 884]

It would seem that these problems about injuries could all be prevented.  It would only require that all discussions regarding injuries be kept confidential solely between the team representatives and the player with the injury. Public and sports press releases would be confined only to the type of injury and estimated time of return and status updates.  Any disclosure of anything else, including opinions of staff to other players or the press, other than likelihood of playing and estimated time of return, would be cause for league fine or civil lawsuit or both.  That would stop that kind of shit very quickly. It probably is not as hard as it seems.

 

Let's face it, a medical problem should fall under confidentiality laws, whether it is you or me having colon cancer or a player having a sprain.  A coach expressing an opinion about a player regarding an injury to any other player or the press should be considered a breach of medical confidentiality, slander, or both. A player would be equally liable for such disclosures as part of the standard contract.

[Chiefmanzada 466]

I don't really understand what's to panic over an ankle sprain. NFL teams should have the best medical staff, and sprained ankles usually take at most a month to heal and once healed are not likely to reiterate so he'll be fine before the first game. 

 

Shape wise.... he's an NFL athlete he'll be okay.  

 

I say sit him until the first week. He's an outside tackle, all he does is shuffle his feet and put lots of weight on his ankles, so we want to make sure the swelling is all gone

[Chiefmanzada 466]

Kelvin Benjamin is out with an ACL tear.. knock on wood we aren't dealing with these kinds of injuries 

[West 6,713]

Tempest in a teapot...

 

When the Doctors decide he can play, he will play.

 

The doctors will decide "he is ready to play" when he passes a number of "protocols"

 

The players association has been pretty effective at getting the right protocols in place to take most of the subjectivity out of the process.

 

w

[Bilyous2 884]

Tempest in a teapot...

 

When the Doctors decide he can play, he will play.

 

The doctors will decide "he is ready to play" when he passes a number of "protocols"

 

The players association has been pretty effective at getting the right protocols in place to take most of the subjectivity out of the process.

 

w

That would have saved all of us a lot of words.  It makes sense that the process has been standardized considering all the past lawsuits.  That story about Smith and Nolan was horrible. 

 

Now, if we could only get the government to function like that.

[formerdb 13]

To me, it's unclear what the deal is with his ankle.

It's called a high ankle sprain, which takes 4-6 weeks to get a player on the field.

 

But they say he's working out on the side with trainers and the head trainer says he is doing way better than they would anticipate. 

But what kind of physical activity is he doing...walking, hopping, non weight-bearing movement, light jogs????

If he's doing non weight-bearing exercises, it could be a while.

If he's doing weight-bearing rehab stuff on that ankle already, it's not a high grade sprain.

 

Next week is a good time to see where he is...will he still be rehabing or will he be able to practice?

My guess is that he gets in at least the last preseason game to be ready for the opener...same with Allen.

 

[Bilyous2 884]

They are going to be very careful with a high ankle sprain, as they should be.  FormerDB is right.  It would have to be really, really mild otherwise. He may start the first or second regular season game, but I would be worried if he did, especially if he aggravates it.  My guess all along has been that he won't be fully ready until the 2nd or 3rd game with a high ankle sprain. That would put him at 4-6 weeks.  They will probably want to have him healed and at his best against the Broncos, because that is a division game and, well...the Broncos.  I think that would be appropriate and be around 5 weeks, wouldn't it? Actually closer to 4 weeks.  Since there is a bye after that, it would be great additional conditioning time, so he might not start until the Bengals game.

[wilkie 1,518]

They are going to be very careful with a high ankle sprain, as they should be.  FormerDB is right.  It would have to be really, really mild otherwise. He may start the first or second regular season game, but I would be worried if he did, especially if he aggravates it.  My guess all along has been that he won't be fully ready until the 2nd or 3rd game with a high ankle sprain. That would put him at 4-6 weeks.  They will probably want to have him healed and at his best against the Broncos, because that is a division game and, well...the Broncos.  I think that would be appropriate and be around 5 weeks, wouldn't it? Actually closer to 4 weeks.  Since there is a bye after that, it would be great additional conditioning time, so he might not start until the Bengals game.

My guess as well. I don't want him to play until he can play at a high level.

[oldtimer 8,686]

we have yet to see if he has a "HIgh Level" or not seems to be the problem

[Calichief 3,016]

we have yet to see if he has a "HIgh Level" or not seems to be the problem

My thoughts exactly ..

Yet to show anything dominant

[ATLchief 3,126]

we have yet to see if he has a "HIgh Level" or not seems to be the problem

 

I would be happy to see Eric "Tiffany" Fisher play like a 2nd rounder, yet alone the first overall pick.

 

 

 

Artist's impression of Chiefs' starting left tackle:

 

 

[FANATIC 852]

Reminder: Last year was his first year at LT and the guy next to him was a ghost.

[ATLchief 3,126]

He's still brittle.

[West 6,713]

Time will tell...

 

w

[Bilyous2 884]

we have yet to see if he has a "HIgh Level" or not seems to be the problem

That's true.  Although I suppose it depends on how much percocet they have given him.

[Bilyous2 884]

Reminder: Last year was his first year at LT and the guy next to him was a ghost.

Absolutely.  And he had not built his arm strength back yet.  This is going to be a whole new Eric Fisher who will justify his draft place.  We saw that in his numbers from the Arizona game.

[dhitter 1,424]

My guess as well. I don't want him to play until he can play at a high level.

Play at a high level? He must have been playing with an injury the past two years then

[eraser 722]

Eric Fisher got his ankle rolled over by a 300 lb man. That isn't being fragile. That is just what happens in football at the NFL level. I do not imagine Fisher will be a special player, worthy of his #1 selection in the draft. Look at the 2013 NFL draft, it sucked! Sheldon Richardson was picked #13, he is probably the best in the draft, and he is about to flame out. 

 

The best we can hope for is for Eric Fisher to become a serviceable LT. His second contract, if there is one with the Chiefs, will be adjusted accordingly. He always has looked like a better RT than a LT to me. Its a crock that people argue he wasn't good at RT because he was used to playing on the left side. He wasn't good at RT because he sucked, and he was hurt. 

 

As a LT, Fisher is a bottom third starter. As a RT, he could become a top third starter. To be honest, Stephenson looks more like a LT than Fisher, and vice versa. However, I predict Fisher will remain at LT unless he moves around the league, and has to settle at RT. That's a shame too. It appears to me his progress is retarded because of where he was drafted, and because he was drafted to plat LT. 

[Calichief 3,016]

Eric Fisher got his ankle rolled over by a 300 lb man. That isn't being fragile. That is just what happens in football at the NFL level. I do not imagine Fisher will be a special player, worthy of his #1 selection in the draft. Look at the 2013 NFL draft, it sucked! Sheldon Richardson was picked #13, he is probably the best in the draft, and he is about to flame out.

 

The best we can hope for is for Eric Fisher to become a serviceable LT. His second contract, if there is one with the Chiefs, will be adjusted accordingly. He always has looked like a better RT than a LT to me. Its a crock that people argue he wasn't good at RT because he was used to playing on the left side. He wasn't good at RT because he sucked, and he was hurt.

 

As a LT, Fisher is a bottom third starter. As a RT, he could become a top third starter. To be honest, Stephenson looks more like a LT than Fisher, and vice versa. However, I predict Fisher will remain at LT unless he moves around the league, and has to settle at RT. That's a shame too. It appears to me his progress is retarded because of where he was drafted, and because he was drafted to plat LT.

Again yes. Stephenson looks much better at LT than fish.