Chiefs vs Donks - Game Thread

[BroncoStud 3,253]

You mean for Denver...I agree. First fumble I was willing to excuse. 2nd one was obviously the game...that one is tough to swallow.

I actually felt physical pain just imaging what that would feel like for the Chiefs fans.  Frustrating loss probably doesn't scratch the surface.

[Calichief 3,016]

Was there only 1 WR playing for the Chiefs tonight?

Read my other post.

Al Wilson has 1 target!!! One

You can't forget about a side of the field. This version of the west coast sucks.

Starting to think Alex can't go through progressions

[azchief21 5,278]

I actually felt physical pain just imaging what that would feel like for the Chiefs fans.  Frustrating loss probably doesn't scratch the surface.

It's a game. We didn't lose a relative

[dhitter 1,424]

I actually felt physical pain just imaging what that would feel like for the Chiefs fans.  Frustrating loss probably doesn't scratch the surface.

I don't drink so doing that to numb the pain isn't an option. Gotta suffer at full strength. Yeah it pretty much feels like a punch in the gut.

[DefensiveMan 758]

Read my other post.

Al Wilson has 1 target!!! One

You can't forget about a side of the field. This version of the west coast sucks.

Starting to think Alex can't go through progressions

The speed of the game is so fast. Especially with a bad O Line. But let's face it Denver has a shitty Oline, In fact the entire league does...but they got it done.

[BroncoStud 3,253]

It's a game. We didn't lose a relative

I like football more than I do some of my relatives...............

[PhataLerror 370]

If you're Smith in this game, you're wishing that the Broncos had a Jamell Fleming playing at corner instead of Chris Harris and Aqib Talib.

 

A little bit of blocking would have been nice, too. Just a little.

 

If not for Charles' first fumble, the Chiefs likely lead by 3 after a futile touchdown-scoring march downfield by Manning. If not for Charles' second fumble, the Chiefs at least have overtime to play. Thomas' punt return fumble robbed Smith of a possession, which always seems to happen in games where Smith has competently helped his team get a comfortable lead, and was likely the better quarterback on the field, all things considered. Smith didn't give up a pick-six. Peyton Manning is doing a Matt Schaub imitation. (In case you haven't been keeping count, Peyton Manning has a regular season streak four games in the running where he has given up a fumble or an interception returned for a touchdown.)

 

Smith got drilled again and again this game trying to make throws downfield, and Smith's had three pass catchers with a longest reception longer than Manning's game-longest 22-yard completion to Demaryius Thomas.

 

Jamaal Charles... well... if you're going after Smith after a game like this, it's because you have your favorites.

 

One more thing: It's "Bend But Don't Break", not "Bend and Then Break". A bunch of you complain about Alex Smith not being able to lead this team... the Chiefs were leading by seven points with less than 2:30 to play, but once again, the defense gave up seven points. Smith did his share. He's not going to return punts, and he's not going to cover Emmanuel Sanders. Those tasks are the jobs of other players.

 

Bag on the guys that didn't do their jobs this game: Jamaal Charles, Jamell Fleming, Jah Reid, and De'anthony Thomas.

[FANATIC 852]

If you're Smith in this game, you're wishing that the Broncos had a Jamell Fleming playing at corner instead of Chris Harris and Aqib Talib.

 

A little bit of blocking would have been nice, too. Just a little.

 

If not for Charles' first fumble, the Chiefs likely lead by 3 after a futile touchdown-scoring march downfield by Manning. If not for Charles' second fumble, the Chiefs at least have overtime to play. Thomas' punt return fumble robbed Smith of a possession, which always seems to happen in games where Smith has competently helped his team get a comfortable lead, and was likely the better quarterback on the field, all things considered. Smith didn't give up a pick-six. Peyton Manning is doing a Matt Schaub imitation. (In case you haven't been keeping count, Peyton Manning has a regular season streak four games in the running where he has given up a fumble or an interception returned for a touchdown.)

 

Smith got drilled again and again this game trying to make throws downfield, and Smith's had three pass catchers with a longest reception longer than Manning's game-longest 22-yard completion to Demaryius Thomas.

 

Jamaal Charles... well... if you're going after Smith after a game like this, it's because you have your favorites.

 

One more thing: It's "Bend But Don't Break", not "Bend and Then Break". A bunch of you complain about Alex Smith not being able to lead this team... the Chiefs were leading by seven points with less than 2:30 to play, but once again, the defense gave up seven points. Smith did his share. He's not going to return punts, and he's not going to cover Emmanuel Sanders. Those tasks are the jobs of other players.

 

Bag on the guys that didn't do their jobs this game: Jamaal Charles, Jamell Fleming, Jah Reid, and De'anthony Thomas.

Yes all those things are true. And Smith still sucks. It was obvious he looked to run too soon. Now we know why SF dumped him.

[FANATIC 852]

Knowing we are stuck with Smith is not a good thing. Even with better oline play this guy is never going to win a big game.

[azchief21 5,278]

If you're Smith in this game, you're wishing that the Broncos had a Jamell Fleming playing at corner instead of Chris Harris and Aqib Talib.

 

A little bit of blocking would have been nice, too. Just a little.

 

If not for Charles' first fumble, the Chiefs likely lead by 3 after a futile touchdown-scoring march downfield by Manning. If not for Charles' second fumble, the Chiefs at least have overtime to play. Thomas' punt return fumble robbed Smith of a possession, which always seems to happen in games where Smith has competently helped his team get a comfortable lead, and was likely the better quarterback on the field, all things considered. Smith didn't give up a pick-six. Peyton Manning is doing a Matt Schaub imitation. (In case you haven't been keeping count, Peyton Manning has a regular season streak four games in the running where he has given up a fumble or an interception returned for a touchdown.)

 

Smith got drilled again and again this game trying to make throws downfield, and Smith's had three pass catchers with a longest reception longer than Manning's game-longest 22-yard completion to Demaryius Thomas.

 

Jamaal Charles... well... if you're going after Smith after a game like this, it's because you have your favorites.

 

One more thing: It's "Bend But Don't Break", not "Bend and Then Break". A bunch of you complain about Alex Smith not being able to lead this team... the Chiefs were leading by seven points with less than 2:30 to play, but once again, the defense gave up seven points. Smith did his share. He's not going to return punts, and he's not going to cover Emmanuel Sanders. Those tasks are the jobs of other players.

 

Bag on the guys that didn't do their jobs this game: Jamaal Charles, Jamell Fleming, Jah Reid, and De'anthony Thomas.

A lot of players and coaches had bad games. Are you incapable of admitting Smith can possibly have a bad game? Are you a Smith fan and he just happens to play for the Chiefs? Were you a 49er fan when he played there? Maybe a Chiefs board isn't good for you. Do they have an Alex Smith discussion board? 

[eraser 722]

The game sucked. Alex Smith shoulda coulda... there was plenty of blame to pass around. The Chiefs played with a lot of heart. They blew it. That happens. The task now is to get over it. If they win the next 14 in a row, no one will be talking about the one in KC that got away. 

 

Any touchdowns to a WR? Oh, snap!

[PhataLerror 370]

The essay from phatal is coming. Don't worry.

I hope you didn't miss it. It was incredibly concise.

 

Smith cannot throw that first interception. That's on him.

 

As for the other 28 dropbacks, he made the right play in almost every case, but his team failed him.

 

But while you've got me going some more, let's look at the Chiefs' non-converted third downs:

 

#1: 3rd and 5, and a blitzing linebacker goes by Jah Reid untouched; Jamaal Charles' reception should have led to no gain and a field goal attempt.

#2: 3rd and 24, set up by a false start, a sack, and a second sack.

#3: 3rd and 8, a play that statistically never happened, where an untouched Von Miller blows up Smith just after the snap; the Unnecessary Roughness penalty resulted in a first down.

#4: 3rd and 9, and Smith is forced to dump off to Jamaal Charles, who does not fumble this time; the Chiefs score three points on the subsequent field goal.

#5: 3rd and 12 (instead of 3rd and 7 after the Chiefs' fourth false start penalty of the game; the Broncos had no false start penalties), and De'anthony Thomas gets 8 yards on a short pass.

#6: 3rd and 6, and Alex Smith scrambles for two yards on what would have otherwise been a sack (or perhaps another swatted arm pass-turned-interception).

#7: 3rd and 10, and Alex Smith gets sacked (again).

#8: 3rd and 10, and yet another play that might have been followed by a field goal attempt likely to have been made, except for the part where Smith's arm gets swatted by Jah Reid's assignment 2.6 seconds after the snap, whereafter the pass falls into the arms of Chris Harris.

 

I'm not going easy on Smith when I list these, but he did not have time, nor did he have functional situations. As bad as his offensive line played, his offense put 17 points on the board, and it was clear that Jamaal Charles was ripping off some big runs (when he wasn't fumbling) because Smith was too much of a threat to commit everything to stopping Charles. As for Manning, he converted primarily third-and-shorts, or he went at Jamell Fleming to convert the third-and-longs. There was also a goofy blown coverage on third-and-long that Manning found immediately, resulting in the first touchdown completion to Emmanuel Sanders. I'm not sure you'll find such an equally glaring example of terrible coverage on any of Smith's dropbacks.

 

There, I was a little closer to an essay.

[PhataLerror 370]

Bag on the guys that didn't do their jobs this game: Jamaal Charles, Jamell Fleming, Jah Reid, and De'anthony Thomas.

Yes all those things are true. And Smith still sucks. It was obvious he looked to run too soon. Now we know why SF dumped him.

The box scores don't support your accusation: One play was a designed run, on which Smith got a first down. One was a sack salvage. The final run was the one at the end of the game when the Chiefs needed to go 80 yards in :27 seconds with one time out. You can't argue that Smith kept putting his head down. He made some of the toughest throws of the game, and got drilled doing so.

 

Oh, by the way, Reid burned a timeout to spell his defense, and they still gave up the game-tying touchdown. As always, Chiefs fans are expecting Alex Smith to conduct a two-minute drill in thirty seconds, with one timeout, and no offensive line. After Jamaal Charles' GAME-LOSING fumble.

[PhataLerror 370]

A lot of players and coaches had bad games. Are you incapable of admitting Smith can possibly have a bad game? Are you a Smith fan and he just happens to play for the Chiefs? Were you a 49er fan when he played there? Maybe a Chiefs board isn't good for you. Do they have an Alex Smith discussion board? 

That's just low. I guess I'm less a Chiefs fan because I approve of the job Alex Smith is doing? That's the same thing 49ers fans used to say about my 49ers fanship.

 

They say that quarterbacks get too much credit and too much blame. Somehow, Smith is an exception to the rule: His wins have asterisks, and his losses are pegged on him whether his offense puts off 44 points or his teammates put the ball on the ground three times.

[azchief21 5,278]

That's just low. I guess I'm less a Chiefs fan because I approve of the job Alex Smith is doing? That's the same thing 49ers fans used to say about my 49ers fanship.

 

They say that quarterbacks get too much credit and too much blame. Somehow, Smith is an exception to the rule: His wins have asterisks, and his losses are pegged on him whether his offense puts off 44 points or his teammates put the ball on the ground three times.

Last week Smith had a really good game and contributed to the win. This week he had a bad game and contributed to the loss. And no offense but you may less of a Chiefs fan than somebody who has been a Chiefs fan for 10, 20, 40 years regardless of which QB was here. So if Smith goes to the Raiders next year then you become a Raiders fan and would want your man to lead the Raiders to a win over the Chiefs. We will still be Chiefs fans. So I don't consider it low just a fact. Nothing personal. You seem like decent guy. And you have to admit that pass to Talib was a fatal error.Sorry.....had to

[Guest Chieftain]

It's easy to focus on the bad, because there was a lot of the bad this game. However, there was some good, big plays that I was excited to see. The Chiefs shot themselves in the foot countless times this game, very uncharacteristically. Andy went into to Todd Haley mode(play calling wise). It was frustrating to see the Chiefs up(winning) through most of the game to inevitably squander it away.The bright side is there is 14 more games to go this season.

[PhataLerror 370]

Last week Smith had a really good game and contributed to the win. This week he had a bad game and contributed to the loss. And no offense but you may less of a Chiefs fan than somebody who has been a Chiefs fan for 10, 20, 40 years regardless of which QB was here. So if Smith goes to the Raiders next year then you become a Raiders fan and would want your man to lead the Raiders to a win over the Chiefs. We will still be Chiefs fans. So I don't consider it low just a fact. Nothing personal. You seem like decent guy.

So tenure determines the validity of my fanship then? Really, let's not talk about fanship. It's a stupid way to redirect the attention from the more pressing issue: Is Alex Smith a quality quarterback capable of leading his team to the Super Bowl?

 

How did Smith contribute to the loss? Your thinking is utterly binary on this. Did Manning contribute to the win? His defense scored the winning points. In the eleven possessions Smith's offense had prior to the drive on which Jamaal Charles fumbled for a second time, Smith had kept the Chiefs' defense off of the field for 28:23, not bad considering the state of the offensive line. Manning's team had run thirteen offensive drives in the same amount of time, meaning that per drive, Manning actually gave his team's defense less rest than Smith did his. Smith's offense produced more yardage outright, despite getting fewer possessions. Smith gained more yardage per action play than Manning did.

 

You can measure a quarterback's game in degrees, but if you automatically penalize a quarterback because his team lost, what's the point of the evaluation? If the quarterback throws one bad pass that results in an interception, do you throw out all of the good he did on his other 30 dropbacks? Clearly, you did.

[azchief21 5,278]

"How did Smith contribute to the loss?" 

 

Two plays later, Aqib Talib picked off Smith's throw on a poorly thrown pass in the flat, and the Broncos needed just four plays for Manning to find Virgil Green with a tying touchdown toss. 

 

That's from NFL.com

 

So that's a way to contribute to the loss.

[PhataLerror 370]

"How did Smith contribute to the loss?" 

 

Two plays later, Aqib Talib picked off Smith's throw on a poorly thrown pass in the flat, and the Broncos needed just four plays for Manning to find Virgil Green with a tying touchdown toss. 

 

That's from NFL.com

 

So that's a way to contribute to the loss.

As I said,

Your thinking is utterly binary on this.

I guess Manning's pick-six never happened. I guess Manning's failed third-down conversions never happened.

 

You allow one play to define a player's entire impact on the game. That is, if you are talking about Smith. You are employing a double-standard, and you don't even know it.

[azchief21 5,278]

As I said,

I guess Manning's pick-six never happened. I guess Manning's failed third-down conversions never happened.

 

You allow one play to define a player's entire impact on the game. That is, if you are talking about Smith. You are employing a double-standard, and you don't even know it.

I said contribute. Didn't say Smith was the entire reason for loss. JC's fumbles contributed to the loss. Manning's pick six did not contribute to a loss. They won.

[PhataLerror 370]

I said contribute. Didn't say Smith was the entire reason for loss. JC's fumbles contributed to the loss. Manning's pick six did not contribute to a loss. They won.

My point is, at what point do you say, "Smith made mistakes, but he managed the game well"? At what point do you acknowledge that if not for the first of Jamaal Charles' two fumbles, the Chiefs might have had a 10 point lead with two-and-a-half minutes to play? At what point do you acknowledge that the losing quarterback may have played better than the winning one?

 

In other words, at what point do you stop framing an issue as one that demands the replacement of the quarterback rather than, Ball Control, Ball Control, Ball Control? If not for those three fumbles, the defense did in fact play well enough for the Chiefs to win, and the offense would have also done its part despite a terrible showing by the offensive line.

 

If you want perfect play from Alex Smith, he's going to need more than two seconds in the pocket, and he's going to need a spot to throw from. He didn't get either on most dropbacks.

[Guest Chieftain]

KC: 5 Turnovers

Den: 1 Turnover

 

KC: 314 total yards

Den: 299 total yards

 

Time of possession:

 

Den: 31:30

KC: 28:30

 

If KC would have been able to kick a FG rather than turn the ball over in the red zone in the 4th quarter they would have been up by 10 and had a much higher chance to win. I thought a run up the middle would have been a much better play call, in that situation you take the conservative approach and go up by 2 scores. That Turnover by Smith was almost as costly as Jamaals fumble to end the game. The Chiefs would have surely won if they didn't turn the ball over 4 more times than the Broncos. It's actually quite impressive they only lost by 7 with a -4 Turnover margin.

[liquidfriend 1,151]

Martyball offense isn't going to get the job done in this era.

 

Sucks for them as they're stuck with it for awhile longer.

 

There's so much to go over that I don't even know where to begin.

[Guest Chieftain]

Hindsight is 20/20. I wonder what the average team loses by with a -4 Turnover margin.

[gochiefsgo 380]

The only thing that you can point to is that it's a long season. I just hope the Chiefs themselves can overcome this psychologically. For Longtime Chiefs fans this will be added to that ever growing list of disappointments. Just another brick in the wall.