Who's the culprit??

[artsy 1,137]

Okay guys, it's been talked about long enough, and I'd like to know what you guys think!
 

Why is Andy Reid's offensive gameplan\playcalling so damn conservative......(or STUPID)?

 

1. Is it because that's just how Reid is? (He thinks his system is far more superior than his players abilities)

 

2. Or, do you think he draws up the screens, dump-offs and quick timing routes, because of Alex Smith's inability to make the proper reads and go downfield?

 

 

For so long, I've believed in option #1.

However, with the signing of Nick Foles, and watching AS11 so far this season, I've begin to swing in the direction of option #2.

 

What say you, coalition?

 

 

[KCSLC2008 606]

I think it is both and both could be wrong, meaning that Smith might be more capable than Reid thinks he is and Reid is callingthe wrong plays. I tend to go against this because after four years, he should know Smith and he has a reputation with quarterbacks, right or wrong.

 

Smith might be more capable than Smith thinks, or is on the wrong page with Reid and makes decisions accordingly. I think the solution would be that Smith needs to execute better and maybe that will open up calls to something else than these dumb plays.

[PhataLerror 370]

Why is Andy Reid's offensive gameplan\playcalling so *** conservative......(or STUPID)?

 

1. Is it because that's just how Reid is? (He thinks his system is far more superior than his players abilities)

 

2. Or, do you think he draws up the screens, dump-offs and quick timing routes, because of Alex Smith's inability to make the proper reads and go downfield?

You left out Number Three: The offensive line can't accommodate a downfield passing game. You can't throw the ball deep if the quarterback doesn't have a pocket to step up into only two seconds after the snap. The Chiefs' offensive line just gave up 4 sacks to a defensive unit that managed only one sack over their first three games. In this situation, the screens (when properly executed), quick slants, and flats passes are much more likely to be successful in gaining meaningful yardage on a consistent basis. Those plays also happen to be integral to an effective West Coast Offense, which is the scheme Reid prefers and in which Smith can excel.

 

Andy Reid didn't sign Nick Foles to be competition for Alex Smith. Foles is inferior to Smith in almost every measure.

[KCSLC2008 606]

You left out Number Three: The offensive line can't accommodate a downfield passing game. You can't throw the ball deep if the quarterback doesn't have a pocket to step up into only two seconds after the snap. The Chiefs' offensive line just gave up 4 sacks to a defensive unit that managed only one sack over their first three games. In this situation, the screens (when properly executed), quick slants, and flats passes are much more likely to be successful in gaining meaningful yardage on a consistent basis. Those plays also happen to be integral to an effective West Coast Offense, which is the scheme Reid prefers and in which Smith can excel.

 

Andy Reid didn't sign Nick Foles to be competition for Alex Smith. Foles is inferior to Smith in almost every measure.

I saw a few times Smith bailed the pocket when staying might have been ok. Having said that, I don't know the playcall or reads. I'm not saying that the playcall would be to bail the pocket, but I am saying that if he had stepped up, I don't know throwing lanes or vision. I don't know if Smith will be more willing to pull the trigger if he were in that pocket or whether the receivers would be in the right place or catch the ball. The point is, Smith has some blame, but I can't just replace what happened with great plays. We don't know what would happen.

[artsy 1,137]

Watching the first 4 games, I've only saw a the pocket actually collapse a handful of times, where the guards just got beat, or Schwartz got beat. Even then, AS11 did not keep his eyes downfield. How many times have we saw him snap the ball look at a WR, and then immediately put his head down and start looking for a place run\hide....Even when the line was blocking fine. Hell, Sunday night he tripped over his on feet trying to weave through the blockers.

 

He seems extremely gun shy. Scared as hell to stand in there and take a hit to deliver the strike. That's why I'm wondering if Reid is saying to himself:

 

"Shit, Alex won't stand in there long enough to let the deep plays develop, so I might as well take my chances with the quick screens and slants and hope for as much YAC as possible?"

 

Or maybe you guys are right about the oline....Maybe Reid calls the plays he's been calling because of the oline??? Maybe he thinks they're not playing good enough?

 

Someone/Something is way off. We've got talent and speed galore on this offense and most of them, with the exception of Hill, have been in the offense at LEAST 2 years. This offense should not be this ineffective.

 

By the way,...Is Foles really inferior to AS11?? In what sense?

 

Accuracy? Arm Strength? Progressing thru his reads? What? I think Foles is just a good or better.

[azchief21 5,278]

Alex is a very average QB. With an average QB the offense will always be......... average. We have one of the fastest WR in the league but Alex can't reach him. A wasted weapon that we hope can break a WR screen. Why wouldn't you fling a couple per game to Hill on a fly pattern? Foles dropped some bombs on Desean Jackson. Go look at those stats for the year they played together. At the very minimum, you loosen up the defense. At this point, the defenses just basically keep everybody in front of them and try to make tackles to limit YAC. I'm sure Foles can throw slants & screens but he could bring the deep ball threat. None of this is Smith's fault. Hell I commend the guy for getting contracts and pulling this off. He is exactly what he has been since he came in to the league.

[DieHard 2,061]

It was one of those days days. Drops, bad blocking, AS bailing a sound pocket right into a sack, returning kick offs to the five yard line, safeties 20 yards out of position, a CB stopping and chasing butterflies while an intreceptacle ball floats in for a TD. Man-o-man. Just one of those dates.

 

Philly stomped them with 33% of their plays being screens. It was not a bad game plan for that team, just more bone headed plays than you could could could count. We are better than that. Not where we need to be, but better than that.

[azchief21 5,278]

It was one of those days days. Drops, bad blocking, AS bailing a sound pocket right into a sack, returning kick offs to the five yard line, safeties 20 yards out of position, a CB stopping and chasing butterflies while an intreceptacle ball floats in for a TD. Man-o-man. Just one of those dates.

 

Philly stomped them with 33% of their plays being screens. It was not a bad game plan for that team, just more bone headed plays than you could could could count. We are better than that. Not where we need to be, but better than that.

I am not breaking it down to a game or two. All teams have bad days. I'm talking about the offense overall.

[DieHard 2,061]

It is disappointing. I don't know how much is Andy and how much is Alex, but it is subpar. And should be humming. I think we have one of the worst pass blocking lines and we shouldn't. Our Guards are hurt, but even the tackles are struggling. Watt looked like a rock star against us and washed up against everyone else.

[Okiechief1 425]

Combo of a few things. Alex missing some reads, ill timed turnovers. They lost 8 fumbles all of last year, already at 5 thru 4 games. starting field position is about 5 yards less than last year. Maybe it's me but they aren't taking many knees in the end zone on a ko, instead trying for the big play and bringing it out sometime starting inside the 20. Wr drops Alex doesn't seem to be as accurate this year for some reason and the oline not playing as well as people thought. Again maybe me, penalties at the wrong time.

 

Add in the playcalling and you get what we are seeing.

[eraser 722]

Alex Smith had a slow start last season. He finished strong, except for the final game, where he reverted. AS gets happy feet, and leaves the pocket too soon. He leaves a lot of big plays on the field. He is conservative, but this is not really about that. This is about AS failing to see the field, and find the better option. He does not read defenses as well as one might believe he would. 

[kccrow 529]

I wouldn't normally direct you guys to the Planet, but if you peek in over there, there is thread upon thread with All22 footage showing just how bad Alex Smith has been. He's missing read, after read, after read. Receivers wide open down field. I'm done with Alex Smith, and until the Chiefs make a change at QB, they can go fuck themselves in the ass with an iron rod. 

[SEMO 6,811]

But...but...but...

 

We have mountains of info posted here showing it is the oline and receivers' fault.

[Calichief 3,016]

I wouldn't normally direct you guys to the Planet, but if you peek in over there, there is thread upon thread with All22 footage showing just how bad Alex Smith has been. He's missing read, after read, after read. Receivers wide open down field. I'm done with Alex Smith, and until the Chiefs make a change at QB, they can go fuck themselves in the ass with an iron rod.

I've said this from day one. Day one. I warned everyone after living here watching his inability to move the ball around and push it down field.

[KCSLC2008 606]

I told my wife after his emotional response to beating San Diego that I felt that he left it all on the field (a good thing) and I was concerned that he left it all on the field (a not so good thing). I thought it was good to show emotion because he rarely does and it obviously does not have a direct effect, but there are times that I've seen other quarterbacks show that type of emotion and I always felt that it was a release of frustration or an ego thing or a draining thing. I don't think that Smith has that big of an ego so it must be the others or irrelevant.

 

I don't think I will ever say never and I certainly understand those who do say never, but I feel this year is different than last year. I disagreed with those who said he couldn't because I felt that in his prime, he could but stupid things can't happen like fumbles, injuries, or for a collapse around him. I disagree with people who said that it had to be perfect, but there are a lot of things that have gone beyond not perfect that have stopped us, including Smith. Where he is right now, I won't say, but I feel he was good enough before to win it all or advance further.

 

It doesn't have to be perfect but losing a player that wasn't perfect to begin with was too much. Going from Jamaal to his backup was ok, going to the backup's backup, was not. Fumbling once might have been ok, but twice was not. Brady might overcome two fumbles, he might lose with two fumbles, he might win with no fumbles, it just isn't the same. Again, doesn't have to be perfect but we must have all our opportunities to score (not more than one fumble or not one bad timing fumble) and it has to be the original guys (who are not perfect!) or at least their backup.

 

We are getting Jamaal back, our oline should get healthy, and while Smith will not change his colors, hopefully he'll play significantly better or poorly enough to switch, even though I don't want that. If they already switched, fine, that might be a good thing, might not. But if they haven't, I'm rooting for him to not only play well enough to keep the job but as well as he can, which should make this year better than last.

[Calichief 3,016]

I wouldn't normally direct you guys to the Planet, but if you peek in over there, there is thread upon thread with All22 footage showing just how bad Alex Smith has been. He's missing read, after read, after read. Receivers wide open down field. I'm done with Alex Smith, and until the Chiefs make a change at QB, they can go fuck themselves in the ass with an iron rod.

I went and watched it all. It was apparent on tv but those videos are telling. Conley running free all over the place wide open.

[Okiechief1 425]

They won't make a switch during the year imo. I just hope we arent looking at pioli/cassel part 2 with Andy being to stubborn to do make a switch.

[azchief21 5,278]

I've said this from day one. Day one. I warned everyone after living here watching his inability to move the ball around and push it down field.

I never really watched him much at SF. I was optimistic when he was coming here. His inability or fear to push the ball down field changed my mind. Every QB drafted in the NFL should be able to throw screens, slants and swing passes, it's what they do down the field that makes a difference in a game, season, career. He can run for an occasional 1st down, which is helpful. Regardless of what you think of Harbaugh (I think he's a douche), he has been very successful everywhere he's been. I think he knows a little about talent. He chose Kaepernick over Smith. Why?

[KCSLC2008 606]

I never really watched him much at SF. I was optimistic when he was coming here. His inability or fear to push the ball down field changed my mind. Every QB drafted in the NFL should be able to throw screens, slants and swing passes, it's what they do down the field that makes a difference in a game, season, career. He can run for an occasional 1st down, which is helpful. Regardless of what you think of Harbaugh (I think he's a douche), he has been very successful everywhere he's been. I think he knows a little about talent. He chose Kaepernick over Smith. Why?

I see where you are going and deep attempts helped. So did teams not knowing the read option, teams not knowing Kaepernick, Kaepernick having nothing to lose (INT and its back to your old job, TD and hello starting job). I don't think it is this, and I hope it isn't since Smith has been mentally tough in the past, but Smith was taking more shots last year with no Foles here.

[kccrow 529]

I went and watched it all. It was apparent on tv but those videos are telling. Conley running free all over the place wide open.

 

Glad you watched it. Pretty damn eye-opening.

 

Here are the thread titles for those of you that want to watch more:

 

 

Alex Smith: Chiefs' offensive strategy will look much different this year  (I believe page 5 or 6 onward)

 

Alex missing reads (whole thread has gifs and still frames)

[Okiechief1 425]

I watched the second one. Yea..

[Chiefmanzada 466]

It alarms me that he doesn't hang in the pocket like a QB should. He's ducking and rolling out more frequently than the previous years. Out of all the times he's been sacked, how many are within the pocket?! It's as if he checks his first read and if it isn't there, he rolls out, eliminating an entire half of the field

[DieHard 2,061]

We seldom complete a pass when he rolls out. It's run or throw it away. Do our WRs quit trying to get open in that situation or can Alex just not find them? I don't know.

[KCSLC2008 606]

It alarms me that he doesn't hang in the pocket like a QB should. He's ducking and rolling out more frequently than the previous years. Out of all the times he's been sacked, how many are within the pocket?! It's as if he checks his first read and if it isn't there, he rolls out, eliminating an entire half of the field

I feel he has been better at that from 2011 until last year. For some reason, he's done that more this year.

[KCSLC2008 606]

We seldom complete a pass when he rolls out. It's run or throw it away. Do our WRs quit trying to get open in that situation or can Alex just not find them? I don't know.

I do think that the previous three games were better than this last one, but this last one did have a few times where he got into scrambling mode and didn't look up field. I'm not saying he usually looks up field, but it was significantly worse this game.

 

I'm not going to put all the blame on him or make all the same conclusion as other people, but these last three games really have, I think, been really bad, perhaps the worst stretch of his time here. And that was after his best game in terms of coming back.

 

I would never say turn the corner for just one game and I know he has come back before in his career, but that was something we hadn't seen before. If we had competed in this game and beat Houston, I would probably have more confidence due to the San Diego game. However, if we get down against Oakland like we did in San Diego, even though he came back in the San Diego game, I don't think that I would look to that to think we would do it again. And that isn't because Oakland is better, even though they are, then San Diego. And it's not because of where the game is going to be played.

 

I believe Smith can get back to where he was last year and I hope the coaches can make some adjustments to how defenses are defending us. When the season schedule came out, I hated the early bye, but this might be good for us. I think that rest of the season will go somewhere in between the Jets game and San Diego but that's because I'm an optimist. We would still have offensive problems and the start of games would still be an issue, but we'd have some wins.