Mloe68 1,521 Posted April 24, 2018 Share Posted April 24, 2018 This is pretty spot on. I’m merely trying to be objective about Mahomes, nothing more. And RGIII is a great example of a guy who was being called all sorts of great things in year one and POOF! Far more first round QBs have busted in this league than not. I don’t believe PM2 will be one of them, but lots of others who’ve come from similar systems have. There are no sure things in the NFL. Even the great prospect in the last decade (Andrew Luck) hasn't had a stellar career at all. Injuries are another thing that can and often do derail a career. Again my greatest confidence comes less from PM because we really don't know what we have for sure yet, but rather from Andy's confidence in him and his track record with QBs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Calichief 3,017 Posted April 24, 2018 Share Posted April 24, 2018 Jeff George without the attitude Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mloe68 1,521 Posted April 24, 2018 Share Posted April 24, 2018 I think Griffin's decline had FAR more to do with injury than attitude problems. Or, at the least, the injury problems came first and then the attitude problems developed/surfaced. Given that the premise of my original hypothetical was not including injury, I don't think that's a great comparison. I've just read to many people who had knowedge of what was going on in his locker rooms say that he's very selfish and uncoachable. He's been healthy for years now and there's a reason nobody has given him a legit chance again. Maybe he will prove me wrong this year, but it seems unlikely. To me this is just another case of a guy believing his press clippings and not working hard to get better or understand how to play within his limitations. See Vince Young. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adamixoye 604 Posted April 24, 2018 Author Share Posted April 24, 2018 I've just read to many people who had knowedge of what was going on in his locker rooms say that he's very selfish and uncoachable. He's been healthy for years now and there's a reason nobody has given him a legit chance again. Maybe he will prove me wrong this year, but it seems unlikely. To me this is just another case of a guy believing his press clippings and not working hard to get better or understand how to play within his limitations. See Vince Young. Well I'm not necessarily going to deny that there weren't also attitude issues, I've heard some of that but I'm also very skeptical of rumors of locker room drama that can't really be verified. Having said that, the team really screwed him over getting him injured in the first place and how they handled him. Given how dynamic he was in that first year and then how he never really flashed that athleticism again, I just don't see how anyone wouldn't point to injury as the dominant reason for his career decline. Then, once injured, lots of other stuff came into play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mloe68 1,521 Posted April 24, 2018 Share Posted April 24, 2018 if that happens, the franchise may never recover If that did happen I pray we don't abandon the idea of drafting a QB for the next three decades. As long as we don't give up, it wouldn't bury us long term. Short term, yes indeed. But we don't have a massive investment here like say the Redskins did for RGIII. Cheap contract and a few early draft picks that we supplmented by trading Alex. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thegoatee 1,781 Posted April 24, 2018 Share Posted April 24, 2018 How can anyone say Brodie Croyle? Mahomes with a bunch of backups has more wins than Croyle. He already has a better legacy if he never played another game. His floor is probably Cutler, who was a viable starter most of his career. He could easily be a Stafford or Rivers, good QB on teams that never win when it matters. But for the first time since Montana, and maybe Green, we have a guy who could make a difference and take us to new levels. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robgar 1,046 Posted April 25, 2018 Share Posted April 25, 2018 I would say his floor is Green.... he may even remind us of green a bit at times specially his first year or two... Dont suppose anybody remembers why there was a term here .. the trinterception Greens first year was bad.. But pay attention the release speed ...... its one thing that separates great from terrible.. the one thing that all great qb's have had in common... but throw in the arm strength and it becomes wow.. you want disheartening for a defense. you get to the qb in 2 seconds, he is off balance, nearly sacked.... throws across his body 30 yards downfield and it drops in his receivers arms in stride for a td, on the opposite side of the field .. while you have him in your arms.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dhitter 1,424 Posted April 25, 2018 Share Posted April 25, 2018 All I know is the Chiefs have done just about everything in their power to help Mahomes come closer to his ceiling than his floor. It starts with having a coach like Reid. Sitting behind Smith for a year. Say what you want about AS...he is a smart QB who was a 1st in last out guy. Prepared hard and was a leader. Mahomes has all the arm talent in the world but Alex tutored him on those other important elements. Oline was top ten in pass protection last year according to PFF. Throw in all the weapons..if Mahomes doesn't succeed in that environment then I don't know what would. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mloe68 1,521 Posted April 25, 2018 Share Posted April 25, 2018 I would say his floor is Green.... he may even remind us of green a bit at times specially his first year or two... Dont suppose anybody remembers why there was a term here .. the trinterception Greens first year was bad.. But pay attention the release speed ...... its one thing that separates great from terrible.. the one thing that all great qb's have had in common... but throw in the arm strength and it becomes wow.. you want disheartening for a defense. you get to the qb in 2 seconds, he is off balance, nearly sacked.... throws across his body 30 yards downfield and it drops in his receivers arms in stride for a td, on the opposite side of the field .. while you have him in your arms.. TrINT Green was also popular. He wasn’t nearly the athlete or have nearly the arm of Pat but I agree production and possibly INTs may look similar early. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reesebobby 5,663 Posted April 25, 2018 Share Posted April 25, 2018 Trent Green fixed his interception problems when Brian Waters and Willie Roaf came along to complete what is one of the greatest offensive lines of all time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the Warparty 69 Posted April 25, 2018 Share Posted April 25, 2018 I've just read to many people who had knowedge of what was going on in his locker rooms say that he's very selfish and uncoachable. He's been healthy for years now and there's a reason nobody has given him a legit chance again. Maybe he will prove me wrong this year, but it seems unlikely. To me this is just another case of a guy believing his press clippings and not working hard to get better or understand how to play within his limitations. See Vince Young. Pretty much agree, but also didn't Was change O coordinators? I'm sure that might have hurt RG3 a lot. Esp if he's not very coach able. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DieHard 2,061 Posted April 25, 2018 Share Posted April 25, 2018 Trent Green fixed his interception problems when Brian Waters and Willie Roaf came along to complete what is one of the greatest offensive lines of all time. God Trent had some bad receivers that year. Big Wllie and Waters were steals. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
liquidfriend 1,151 Posted April 25, 2018 Share Posted April 25, 2018 Don't you fucking diss the worm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mloe68 1,521 Posted April 26, 2018 Share Posted April 26, 2018 Trent Green fixed his interception problems when Brian Waters and Willie Roaf came along to complete what is one of the greatest offensive lines of all time. Trent was not remotely the same QB before Roaf or when Roaf was injured. That mid season signing of Eddie Kennison also seemed to spark that offense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moons314 2,463 Posted April 26, 2018 Share Posted April 26, 2018 Mahomes floor is slightly below smiths ceiling. He’s going to throw picks because he’s not afraid to make a play but he’s going to make a ton more plays. A 75 yard td pass isn’t going to be a swing pass taken to the house. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robgar 1,046 Posted April 26, 2018 Share Posted April 26, 2018 Trent Green fixed his interception problems when Brian Waters and Willie Roaf came along to complete what is one of the greatest offensive lines of all time. I still think Wiegmann was probably the most underated player on that line.. but yeah with waters roaf, casey, tate, and shields that oline was possibly truly the best of all time.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sith13 1,746 Posted April 26, 2018 Share Posted April 26, 2018 I still think Wiegmann was probably the most underated player on that line.. but yeah with waters roaf, casey, tate, and shields that oline was possibly truly the best of all time.. Pretty much everyone was a solid piece on that group. I still remember LJ running for a 10+ yard TD untouched behind that line. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mloe68 1,521 Posted April 26, 2018 Share Posted April 26, 2018 Pretty much everyone was a solid piece on that group. I still remember LJ running for a 10+ yard TD untouched behind that line.[/ We ran a sweep around left end the first game of the 2003 season and Priest Holmes basically jogged 24 yards for a TD completely untouched behind our blocking. We also had a dominant blocking fullback and the best run blocking tight end in Jason Dunn. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PAChiefsFan79 136 Posted April 26, 2018 Share Posted April 26, 2018 Pretty much everyone was a solid piece on that group. I still remember LJ running for a 10+ yard TD untouched behind that line.[/ We ran a sweep around left end the first game of the 2003 season and Priest Holmes basically jogged 24 yards for a TD completely untouched behind our blocking. We also had a dominant blocking fullback and the best run blocking tight end in Jason Dunn. I would love to see that type of blocking again in KC... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xen 1,010,220 Posted April 26, 2018 Share Posted April 26, 2018 Floor is Jeff George/Cutler. Big arm but never puts it together. Ceiling is Mahomes. Outside of Rodgers I've not seen anyone that can do what he does. He has the potential to be better than Rodgers in the pocket though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
liquidfriend 1,151 Posted April 26, 2018 Share Posted April 26, 2018 Jason Whitlock just randomly smiled and he knows why. A Jeff George mention. Be still, his cholesterol clogged heart! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mloe68 1,521 Posted April 26, 2018 Share Posted April 26, 2018 I would love to see that type of blocking again in KC... You may never see that type of blocking group with any team ever again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KCSLC2008 607 Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 Mahomes floor is slightly below smiths ceiling. He’s going to throw picks because he’s not afraid to make a play but he’s going to make a ton more plays. A 75 yard td pass isn’t going to be a swing pass taken to the house. And he's not going to need the speed of Hill like Smith did, even though that will help. Most of our deep passes this year were not swing passes. In fact, I was kind of disappointed this year with us not having many of those plays on broken plays like we had in prior years. I mean, did we have any this year? The one exception would be the Hill 70 yard touchdown to end the half against Dallas. I don't see that as a swing past but rather a designed play that was called because we don't do Hail Mary's, hook and ladders are rare, and he'll is so fast. Toub was likely the creator of that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mloe68 1,521 Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 And he's not going to need the speed of Hill like Smith did, even though that will help. Most of our deep passes this year were not swing passes. In fact, I was kind of disappointed this year with us not having many of those plays on broken plays like we had in prior years. I mean, did we have any this year? The one exception would be the Hill 70 yard touchdown to end the half against Dallas. I don't see that as a swing past but rather a designed play that was called because we don't do Hail Mary's, hook and ladders are rare, and he'll is so fast. Toub was likely the creator of that. That was one of the most simple and well designed Hail Mary type plays that you will ever see. But it only works with freak speed like Tyreek has. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robgar 1,046 Posted April 27, 2018 Share Posted April 27, 2018 question... now that you brought that up.... same situation... mahomes, and 2 speed freeks.. do you send one short and one deep? damn thats a nightmare... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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